So who thinks I should nail Verizon for violation of automatic stay??

[olivies]

They have sent me a bill every month since filing. We ended our service with them prior to filing, so the bills are not for current amounts due. I KNOW that must be a violation despite the small print on the back of the bill that says

"If you are or were subject to a bankruptcy proceeding, this statement may include amounts for pre-bankruptcy service. Any such pre-bankruptcy balances are for your information only and you should not pay any pre-bankruptcy amount"

(they still put a "Please pay now" amount on the front for the full balance).

But today I pulled credit reports to see that in October they pulled my credit report for "collection services". OH REALLY??

This has GOT to be a violation, correct?

[scorpion35]

They have sent me a bill every month since filing. We ended our service with them prior to filing, so the bills are not for current amounts due. I KNOW that must be a violation despite the small print on the back of the bill that says (they still put a "Please pay now" amount on the front for the full balance).

But today I pulled credit reports to see that in October they pulled my credit report for "collection services". OH REALLY??

This has GOT to be a violation, correct?

incorrect

[Bell30656]

With the team of lawyers a company that large must have, I would guess that little paragraph about covers it.

[tyson24]

Sounds like it is for informational purposes and they are explaining that to you. It is just like the house payment statement that I get from my mortgage. They are saying it isn't a bill. I believe getting a big company like Verizon for a violation would be difficult. Just hope for discharge and the debt will be gone.

[IBroke]

I guess the bill is covered by that remark.

EDIT: I just did some research and it seems they can check your credit until discharge. If they do it after that, you can sue them. After discharge, they have no permissable purpose any more.

[olivies]

Well, if it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, quacks like a duck..... chances are....

Even the emails for the ebills I have say "Your Bill is now available" with a payment due date and handy little links to make a one time payment.

Then there's the additional charges they added on back in August. They sent us packaging to return the 2 box units to them in July. We moved, so the equipment sat in the box in the garage, ready to be dropped off at UPS to ship back to them. It was one of those things we just kept forgetting to grab off the garage shelf. Well, when we got our bill in September they had tacked on an additional $1000+ for "equipment fees". Now, WHY would they do that if they have no intention to collect? So I finally remembered to drop the box off at the UPS store and this month I had a credit of about the same amount (except for $8, which I can't make sense of).

As for the credit checks- well, in the 3yrs we had them as service providers they never did them. Now they do one and list the reason as "collections"??

The attorney suggests we save some money, draft the letter ourselves. If they continue, then he'll seek sanctions.

[tcreegan]

Hi olivies,

I am not sure why BK lawyers don't jump on stay violations, legal fees are awarded and judges are very favorable to debtors.

Anyhow, as always, document everything including the time you spend dealing with it (this time becomes 'damages')

As to pulling your credit, no law against that...that is how you get all the 'pre-approved' credit card offers in the mail. One section of the credit report has inquiries that count against your score (actual credit applications), and one that doesn't (general inquiries,marketing). If it is in the wrong section, write the credit bureau and get them to move it or remove it. This will be impossible to prove a stay violation on, Verizon will point a finger at the credit bureau who will point a finger back.

Personally, I hope you go after them and the judge makes them pay for your next vacation....no love lost on Verizon from me...

Tom in Colo

[2manybills]

That's very interested. I noticed that Wells Fargo pulled my credit report in July, 2010. We were discharged in December, 2009.

[IBroke]

I have tons of inquiries from CAs as well - listed as "hard" inquiries. It really s**ks big time to have more than 10 inquiries counting against my FICO although I didn't apply for any credit for almost 3 years. I wanted to dispute that when I recently launched my online-dispute with Experian. Guess what?! You don't even have the option to dispute inquiries online.

[StEt0417]

Did you have them for phone service or tv? I didnt know you could claim that in BK. We have a contract with Dish, I was thinking of canceling it and claiming it in BK cause we will be moving and once we move I dont know if the place will allow us to have have a dish on the property. Since our contract with Dish is fairly new we would owe them a quite a bit if we cancel.

[tobee43]

Hi olivies,

I am not sure why BK lawyers don't jump on stay violations, legal fees are awarded and judges are very favorable to debtors.

Anyhow, as always, document everything including the time you spend dealing with it (this time becomes 'damages')

As to pulling your credit, no law against that...that is how you get all the 'pre-approved' credit card offers in the mail. One section of the credit report has inquiries that count against your score (actual credit applications), and one that doesn't (general inquiries,marketing). If it is in the wrong section, write the credit bureau and get them to move it or remove it. This will be impossible to prove a stay violation on, Verizon will point a finger at the credit bureau who will point a finger back.

Personally, I hope you go after them and the judge makes them pay for your next vacation....no love lost on Verizon from me...

Tom in Colo

got that right tom!! i don't get it either...it's a quick buck for the atty and some money for their clients...this is a violation and there should be a motion which reflex's a clear violation of the auto stay was breached.

[tcreegan]

Hi IBroke,

You don't even have the option to dispute inquiries online.

....when the new-fangled technology doesnt work, old fashioned letters and a stamp still work

Tom in Colo

[Pandora]

olivies -

Actually, since you have an attorney who's working for you, you should be sending any demands from creditors to him/her directly. From there, they will determine if a violation exists and if you could get anything out of it. Normally what occurs is your lawyer would send a registered letter stating something to the effect of a "final warning then we sue" type of thing. If they violate again, then thats when you file suit. We're going through this very thing currently due to violations and it's going to take a while, already been a month since our lawyer filed and the actual hearing isnt until sometime in December.

I dont know if, as the others have stated, that simple blurb on the back lets Verizon off or not, but its definitely something to run by your lawyer. However I do know (according to our lawyer) the reason most lawyers dont jump on the bandwagon to file suit is 1. you have to be sure its actually a violation and well documented to prove it and 2. its costly as it does involve court, letters, submissions etc. Ours is actually an AP - and AP's are expensive to bring forward. Luckily in our contract, any motions brought forward as a result of creditor violations is no-charge to do however if we're awarded any monies, we will split it 50/50 with our attorney.

Good luck!

[tobee43]

olivies -

Actually, since you have an attorney who's working for you, you should be sending any demands from creditors to him/her directly. From there, they will determine if a violation exists and if you could get anything out of it. Normally what occurs is your lawyer would send a registered letter stating something to the effect of a "final warning then we sue" type of thing. If they violate again, then thats when you file suit. We're going through this very thing currently due to violations and it's going to take a while, already been a month since our lawyer filed and the actual hearing isnt until sometime in December.

I dont know if, as the others have stated, that simple blurb on the back lets Verizon off or not, but its definitely something to run by your lawyer.

Good luck!

exactly....that's what you're paying them for!! our atty had us send everything to the firm. also the firm we had called many of the creditors for us! we hired the atty's to take the stress off of us and not to incur more stress that needed...we just had to roll some of burdens off to the professionals we trusted.

[biotechsolution]

Hi olivies,

I am not sure why BK lawyers don't jump on stay violations, legal fees are awarded and judges are very favorable to debtors.

Anyhow, as always, document everything including the time you spend dealing with it (this time becomes 'damages')

As to pulling your credit, no law against that...that is how you get all the 'pre-approved' credit card offers in the mail. One section of the credit report has inquiries that count against your score (actual credit applications), and one that doesn't (general inquiries,marketing). If it is in the wrong section, write the credit bureau and get them to move it or remove it. This will be impossible to prove a stay violation on, Verizon will point a finger at the credit bureau who will point a finger back.

Personally, I hope you go after them and the judge makes them pay for your next vacation....no love lost on Verizon from me...

Tom in Colo

It is very tough to prove actual harm and damages. Time isn't usually considered actual harm. Most violations also will be FCRA violations, not handled by the BK court.