Newbie! Please look over my expense sheet?

[janie]

Great site! I have been reading this for days.
Ok, here is my scenerio. Divorced female, over 50, racked up credit cards trying to keep high school sons in their life style before divorce. I have read that happens to mothers and fathers after divorce.
Y ears later, was still using cc to help 2 of my 3 sons, one with drug problem and one disabled son (car accident) (enabler figured that out with counseling) with problems. I booted the last son out 1.5 yr ago. Struggling to keep up with cc debt, refrigerator empty so I can keep current on all bills. Read others struggle with being late on payments for the first time. That was good for me to read, because it hurts to not pay bills. My first time was this week, but I am coping, have cut up all cards! Feel such a relief, yet am nervous.
Please look over my expense sheet and let me know what you think. Current on mortgage and car is paid for. No other assets.
My medical ($275 deductible, eyeglasses, hearing aids batteries & upkeep, 13 Dr.'s,pain management, oral surgeon, etc.., 18 prescriptions past year, several OTC items for conditions prescribed by doctors, upcoming lower jaw surgery medical necessity, 6 extractions in Jan 10), home maintenance (12 yr old double wide manufactured home with 3 broken windows, 2 storm doors need replaced, more), and transportation ( 8 yr Camry with 125,000 miles (racked up with my dr visits out of town, and disabled son with no car for his dr visits, groceries, etc..) figures are quite high. I help my 37 yr old disabled son with food when he needs it. He reimburses me as best as he can. I have told him that he is going to have to figure this out on his own from here on. I am working on compiling proof of expense on these issues.
Mortgage $428.51 (includes property tax & ins.)
Heating/Electric $250
Water/Sewer $30
Telephone $35 (includes internet & tv service job perk
Trash Pickkup $20
Cell phone $39
Home maintenance $250
Food $350
Clothing $80
Laundry/dry cleaning $25
Medical/dental $325
Transportation $250
Recreation/entertain. $65
Auto insurance $64
Personal Items $45
Total expenses $2256.51
My gross income is just below the median by a few hundred dollars. I am so scared of failing Chapter 7 and having to move to Chapter 13.
My attorney says I have nothing to fear.
I won't make it if I have no cc to put gas & food on and make trustee payments for Ch 13. I have no savings! Only a car & home that need repair. If I succeed with Chapter 7, after paying off attorney, $600 to go, I will be putting away for emergency fund! I am 100% confident I have learned my cc lesson. But failing Ch 7 has me so scared....I would be dooomed to worse failure.

[Pandora]

I believe the following will be questioned since its just you (family of 1)

$250 home maintenance - very unrealistic even though you may require things to be replaced, the trustee more than likely will not allow this amount.

$325 medical/dental - you will be required to show actual proof you require this amount on a monthly basis. IRS standard is $60 per person. We claimed $250 and we're a family of 3 and had to provide proof of actual costs.

$65 entertainment - again, we're a family of 3 and get $60 as well as $18 for Netflix (which was separate), so $78 a month.

$80 clothing - standard IRS allowance is $25 per person I believe as we were allowed $75 (again family of 3)


As far as your son and helping him - unless he lives with you or you have concrete reasons for doing so, it probably will not be allowed.

Otherwise, everything else looks okay - just be sure you account for everything, including insurance (auto etc) going up once you file if you're in a credit profiling state

[mrskal]

Welcome Janie, you said you were just under the median. I was just curious if you used the new means test numbers that just started on November 1 to determine this.

[janie]

How can I estimate how much my car insurace might go up? I didn't know about this until I read it on BK forum last night. Is there a link to give me an idea of what the increase would be? Insurance with Citizens/Hanover

Thanks for your input. My attorney wanted me to put $500 for food! He said because I help the son with food. Crazy!

[janie]

Yes, I used the new means test which hurt! Ouch!

Welcome Janie, you said you were just under the median. I was just curious if you used the new means test numbers that just started on November 1 to determine this.

[Pandora]

How can I estimate how much my car insurace might go up? I didn't know about this until I read it on BK forum last night. Is there a link to give me an idea of what the increase would be? Insurance with Citizens/Hanover

Thanks for your input. My attorney wanted me to put $500 for food! He said because I help the son with food. Crazy!

actually its not crazy at all - you're going to have to up something somewhere to account for what the trustee may not allow; your home maintenance will be cut by ALOT - so you need to adjust and account for it some other way. I'd say you're going to be lucky if you get even $100 in home maintenance, you can try of course, but it doesnt mean it will get approved. Change your Food to $500, accounting for the difference.

I dont know how you'd check to see how much your ins. would/could go up - it may not if your state doesnt credit profile. You could call your ins. company and ask.

I dont know what the median is for where you are - but if you have to adjust your schedules due to high areas, it may just push you into a 13 if you dont budget accordingly. Some of your areas are high based on what I've seen on here - so you will have to account for that extra money somewhere.

[Freddy03]

I agree with Pandora

The medical seems high but if you have proof that you pay that every month then it should be ok. You mentioned the extractions. That's a one time deal so it wouldn't be every month.

Also did you include anything for auto maintenance and registration?

[Pandora]

dont forget anything like AAA, newspaper or mag. subscriptions, pet care, and any other type of insurance you may have (life, renters, disability) - oh - and health insurance premiums!

ETA: Also for your son - there are food banks that can assist as well as Angel Food Ministries. Some people like the AFM items, and some dont - but its food nonetheless. If it came down to not eating vs. eating... then the choice is obvious.

[AngelinaCat]

We had forgotten to add in matters such as 'Personal Grooming' i.e., haircuts, etc. The pre-filing credit counseling course we had to take, showed us this.

So we added $30.00 per every two months for me (haircut--shampoo, cut, blow-dry). That is a standard price plus tip in our area. No coloring or anything else. For 'Hub, we added $18.00 every two months for haircuts for him.

Don't forget such things as clothing and shoes. While I routinely shop at thrift and consignment stores, if you have odd sized feet like I do, then you will have to make allowance for that. I have to pay $100 plus for shoes that fit. And I am not talking about having a closet full of shoes. I have a pair of dress shoes, and a pair of work shoes, and one pair of new work shoes (black oxfords) in the closet as a spare.

Good luck.

[janie]

Appreciate all the input!!
Under transportation I included registration, AAA, gas, and maintenance to include wipers, oil changes, antifreeze, filters, average repairs based on 12 mo period, average tire replacement, alignments, etc..
Personal care included hair appt every 6 weeks $35, cosmetics, shampoo, etc.
Entertainment included subscriptions, fast food runs, take out pizza...let me know if still too high
Clothing did include comfort shoes due to wide toe box (arthritic condition) and they are usually around $80. I will lower this if a problem
Medical based on $3,000 put in flexible spending acct and used up by July 1st. No more extractions but have to have $1500 up front for lower jaw surgery in May 2011 & the toe surgery, too. Prescriptions per month are high, $275 deductible included, but I believe I have proof for all of this. I probably should have doctors write up prescription for the OTC stuff, the HydroEye supplement is $30 a month alone!
Home maintenance included repair or maintenance for lawnmower, weedeater, appliances, furnace, AC, and plumbing/faucets, washer hoses, gas for lawnmower, supplies like bug spray, caulking, furnace filters, light bulbs, yearly rock for driveway

He tried AFM & food banks, didn't like but if he is starving! I think I have my helping him out under control now. Informed him I am just as broke as he is.
I am so scared because now I am late on payments and honestly I do not have income to pay for Ch 13 payments....what am I missing!

[janie]

I typed up an explanation of my medical expense, separating the prescribed meds/dr visits from the OTC prescribed stuff.
I have $308 medical and can verify this.
Will they still say no way to it if I have proof?

[FishersMike]

I doubt they can say no on medical if you have documented proof of your monthly expenses. However, it may make them scrutinize every other deduction you are claiming and they might require more proof on other things, i.e. the high maintenance costs, etc.

[tcreegan]

Hi janie, welcome...

My gross income is just below the median by a few hundred dollars .....if this is the case, you only need expenses for Schedule J, not the means-test (just to clarify)

Yes, I used the new means test which hurt! Ouch! ???....shouldn't be an ouch, it got easier to qualify in Ind.

Does your disabled son live with you? If so, be sure you are using the household of 2 for your median income.

On your expenses, you get a perk for being in the 7th Circuit....auto ownership expense is allowed for paid-off vehicles. It is either $200 or $496 depending on what is being allowed in your court.

To get an idea about your expenses, go to the website below and compare your expenses to IRS standards:

http://www.justice.gov/ust/eo/bapcpa/20101101/meanstesting.htm

Good luck with you case,

Tom in Colo

[janie]

Thanks for the info, Tom!
I turned my paperwork in yesterday, but will have a chance to go over the paperwork with my attorney before the next step. I will check out the link. Do you mean I can use the auto ownership expense listed there? Wonder why my attorney didn't use that figure when he did a rough schedule j for me.