Presumption of abuse under 11 U.S.C 707 (b)

[ccsjoe]

Do like my clients do. Start calling your lawyer now and leave 73 virtually idential voice mails each two minutes apart, saying "!!OMG!! , !OMG! I got this letter that I can't understand and I need to talk to you right away!!!! OMG!! OMG!!" So when he gets to work Monday morning his answering machine is smoking and making funny noises.

LOL!!!! Thankfully my attorney emails me during the weekends as well as the week, but this would certainly be a tactic for a call back!!!

[Fallonedward]

It means your income on the means test is above the median for your household size. It doesn't mean that anybody will be requesting any paperwork. It simply means that your 6 month average income is above the median and that, therefore, Chapter 7 is presumptively 'abusive'. As a result, the court, the trustee, or any party in interest can file a motion to have your Chapter 7 case dismissed. See: 11 USC 707

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/11/usc_sec_11_00000707----000-.html

This is one of the central features of the BAPCPA reform act: to force above-median debtors into Chapter 13.

MS: Since I'm the only one that works, with just my income we are below the median for a family of 5 but if you include Hubbys UI then its puts us $2K over median. ugh so confusing

[bizrock]

Called the Clerks office and the lady who I talked to couldn't answer my question of why my papers had presumption of abuse on it she said she would have to talk to more people and look into it and get back to me. I'm not sure if thats a good thing or bad now I have to wait even longer for a answer.

[bizrock]

MS: Since I'm the only one that works, with just my income we are below the median for a family of 5 but if you include Hubbys UI then its puts us $2K over median. ugh so confusing

just because your over by 2k doesn't always mean you can't file ch 7 you just have to complete more paper work to see if your expenses justify the court letting you seek relief from a ch 7 I would meet with a lawyer and see what they have to say. Best of luck to you

[ccsjoe]

fallonedward, bizrock is right. I am 16K over median and filing CH7. I fail the median income parameter, but upon completing means test, I clearly pass without presumption of abuse.

[Fallonedward]

fallonedward, bizrock is right. I am 16K over median and filing CH7. I fail the median income parameter, but upon completing means test, I clearly pass without presumption of abuse.

Is it just that your expenses are that high that it makes it possible to be 16K over and still file a 7?

We were going by the IRS standards as far as our expenses go, but we are way over on transportation (gas), medical (2 kids with chronic illness) and food.

[ccsjoe]

Yes, our expenses are high enough. We are DMI positive on means test by 2.97/month and on Schedule J by 37.89/month

[Fallonedward]

Yes, our expenses are high enough. We are DMI positive on means test by 2.97/month and on Schedule J by 37.89/month

Thanks for sharing that, it makes me feel better

[ccsjoe]

Thanks for sharing that, it makes me feel better

How come?

[Fallonedward]

How come?

Because if your expenses were high and you were 16K over median, I should stop worrying about being 2K over with high expenses

[ccsjoe]

Glad to provide some comfort

[justbroke]

I hope I can help you to stop worrying too. I was $100K over the median.

(But, I am a non-consumer, so that helped, but I still would have made it as a consumer case as well. It's all about the expenses!)

[ccsjoe]

Actually jb helped me stop worrying. I'm peanuts compared to his 100K over...lol.

[bizrock]

So final update not my lawyer or the clerks office can tell me how or why we had presumption of abuse on our papers. they changed it to normal and all is well until my 341. Thanks for all the help

[lunasgal]

My 341 is Aug 30th and I am labeled presumption of abuse due to a severance payment I got ( and spent on living expenses and horse rescue care ) that factored into my last six months of pay... I wish my lawyer would have waited to file when it fell off the six months, as it stresses me out that the US Trustee will be there as well but my lawyer said as long as I write out where the money went and show my bank statements and the fact that I lost my job in March and am making 1/4 of what I made a year ago I will be fine- I am so nervous though! He says I will be fine... We will see, and I will be posting my experiences next week! ( See my other post under my login posted a couple weeks ago )