At&t being butt heads? Chp # 7

[toilettrash]

[jadams]

I suspect you're getting the usual AT&T CSR attitude where they try to simplify things they don't understand and make things worse. For example an ETF being required if you continue service may be correct -- but their explanation of why is inaccurate and misleading (suggesting bankruptcy doesn't include it, etc.).

You may find it impossible to get post-paid service from AT&T without a service agreement (and it's corresponding ETF). I was never able to do it even when providing my own equipment or paying full non-subsidized price for their equipment. I always had to sign for a minimum of one year.

The only way I was ever able to be month to month post-paid was by working off the entire contract length and being careful not to change any services/equipment that required renewing my agreement.

I don't think they're trying to argue that the ETF wasn't included in your filing, I think they're saying to continue with post-paid service post-filing requires a service agreement -- and instead of having to sign a new one, they will continue your old one.

They don't have an obligation to provide you with month to month service post-filing.

Porting the number(s) out to a prepaid carrier and telling them the entire account and everything to do with it needs to be included in their bankruptcy processing may be the best option (ideally porting out should have been done prior to filing since it would automatically cancel service, assess the ETF's, and finalize the account).

Kind of like with an auto lease. If you turn the car in before filing, or reject the lease in the filing, all of it's expenses are included (including things like damage or over mileage charges). But if you continue to drive the car, you will be responsible for all over mileage charges and damage -- not just those incurred after filing.

If you want to continue usage after filing, you can't pick and choose the parts of the contract/agreement that are extended and those that are rejected.

[HMT]

Maybe I'm in the minority here, but I just use a prepaid cell phone through verizon. I just use my phone for emergencies and when I'm out. I was paying for V's smallest time of 400 mins but I never used more than 75 so I was throwing money away. I don't use it for texts since it costs me 30 mins of prepay time and I dislike texting anyhow. Why not tell them if they will continue to charge it you will toss them aside and never go with them again? There are plenty of other cell phone providers out there.

[Bell30656]

They have no obligation to provide you with service. If you don't agree with their terms call any of the other providers that are out there. They will all likely charge you a deposit. Basically, you are trying to dictate the terms at which you are willing to continue service with them. Guess what, they do not have to accept your terms.

You want to early terminate the old accounts with no penalty then start a new account on a month-to-month with no obligation or ETP. Pretty unreasonable on your part.

There's always Go Phone or Metro PCS.

[toilettrash]

thank you to all... My issue is since i am using them now I dont mind porting out but what happens if they charge me the ETF there going to be putting it onto the new account vs old account - then they will report it to a collection agency.

Any suggestions?

[Exployer1234]

So basically you discharged the debt in BK right? Did they close that account and open a new account? If that is the case that is why they can charge you and ETF on the account. If you do not want to use them at all the the debt should be discharged in BK, but the provider does not have to provide any service to you after that point, and can still use the ETF on the new account. When I filed out my BK papers I filed on the amount of the ETF, plus what my actual bill is. I will refuse to sign a new agreement with them, and if they switch my account over to a new account I will walk away from them. I told them 2 weeks ago this when they charged my checking account twice for only one payment.

[toilettrash]

Hey there; i did include the account number in Bankruptcy, they switched it to the new account number. So how do i fix this? I have a sneaky idea if needed; in order to get out of the agreement is I use an address of people i know in Vanc, BC and then i will be out of it lol

[keepinitreal]

if you want to get rid of the $271 early termination fees, but remain on the AT&T network, you could walk away from AT&T contract phones and sign up with a prepaid plan that uses the AT&T network, such as Consumer Cellular or TracFone Wireless (Motorola phones). You would probably have to get 2 new phone numbers though.

http://cellphones.about.com/od/servi...ssnetworks.htm

[Exployer1234]

If they switched the account over to a new account and did not tell you about this then I would ask to speak with a supervisor and continue to speak with someone until it is reversed back to the original account number. If you did not sign a new contract with them then it is their mistake not yours.

I have already caught them doing a lot of things on my account already. I will let you know if they try this with my account after I am discharged in the next couple of weeks.

[justbroke]

A creditor absolutely cannot demand payment on any pre-petition discharged debt in order for you to keep or continue service (period). There is no argument on this one. That's a clear and outright violation of the permanent discharge injunction and some attorneys live for the day a company like AT&T does this.

See Davis v. Georgia Power Company (In re Davis), Adversary Proceeding 04-4003 (Bkrtcy.M.D.Ga. 2004) for a really good case. You probably won't find the final rulings, but Georgia Power used the exact arguments used here on a pre-petition "fees" demanding both the pre-petition fees and the new deposit to continue service.

I do agree with others that what probably happened is that AT&T issued a new account and a new contract. However, you didn't SIGN UP for a new contract. So, you should be able to deal with this by writing a demand letter to AT&T giving them 14 days to take corrective action and respond in writing, or you'll ask the court to look at it. That alone would cost them over $500 to deal with the court... and that's not even for an Adversary Proceeding (AP), that's just the 2 hours for the lawyer to deal with it. They are better off complying.

[toilettrash]

I do agree with others that what probably happened is that AT&T issued a new account and a new contract. However, you didn't SIGN UP for a new contract. So, you should be able to deal with this by writing a demand letter to AT&T giving them 14 days to take corrective action and respond in writing, or you'll ask the court to look at it. That alone would cost them over $500 to deal with the court... and that's not even for an Adversary Proceeding (AP), that's just the 2 hours for the lawyer to deal with it. They are better off complying.

OK SO question for you. how do I let the court know what AT&T is doing? do i just submit the letter to them? I am going to send a certified copy of my actual dispute to AT&T (I faxed it to them already) and also contacted the FCC.. ??

[toilettrash]

If they switched the account over to a new account and did not tell you about this then I would ask to speak with a supervisor and continue to speak with someone until it is reversed back to the original account number. If you did not sign a new contract with them then it is their mistake not yours.


Thanks exactly what i think too

I have already caught them doing a lot of things on my account already. I will let you know if they try this with my account after I am discharged in the next couple of weeks.

Please let me know. When does yours get discharged? how was your creditor meeting, was it scary? I have mine on Thursday

[Exployer1234]

My 60 day mark is on 7/28. I still have one payment left to the trustee for the filing cost that is due on 8/16. My lawyer had to break the 299 dollar trustee fee into 4 payments of 75 dollars. She said the trustee may discharge me prior to the last 75 dollar payment or he may go ahead and discharge the BK at the proper time. I have not checked Pacer in a couple of week to see if it says anything new yet.

The 341 meeting was very easy. The trustee was very nice and the meeting lasted about 5 min. He asked the basic questions that included: Do I have any assets, do I own my vehicle, did I still own the car that was repo'ed, and what did I do with my tax refund and student loan checks I received. He also asked me again what the value of the car was that I owned. He then said "no-asset case have a nice day". The trustee will also ask if you have any additional questions and you can ask him about the At&T situation you are having as well at the meeting.

[Exployer1234]

I looked through my old bills and my account number is still the same. I would also ask AT&T show you the letter stating they changed your account number. They need to prove that the old account does not exist and that you signed a contract for the new account.

[DebtHater]

OK SO question for you. how do I let the court know what AT&T is doing? do i just submit the letter to them? I am going to send a certified copy of my actual dispute to AT&T (I faxed it to them already) and also contacted the FCC.. ??

You may also want to find out about suing AT&T about this since it may violate federal bankruptcy law.