Stupid Schedule J Question

[coolmom04]

On schedule J, it's okay to take the past 12 months of expenses you paid in something, add it all together, and divide it by 12 to get your average monthly payment isn't it??? That's what I did when we filled out my "debt payments" for schedule J. I was behind on two of my cards, but knew what I was supposed to be paying and had been paying up until January (we filed in March).

So, when I average out my debts for the last 12 months, the total is $250/month for credit cards, student loans, and tuition (all considered non-filing spouses "debts" that we were told to include). The average for the last six months before filing is $206/month. I wrote down $150/month on schedule J.

In January and February though, we only paid about $100/month b/c money was so tight and we just couldn't do it.

So... I guess what I am wondering is... did I come up with the $150/month on schedule J in correct way?

[rpertusio]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but Credit card payments should not be put on Schedule J. "J" is for living expenses. "Installment" payments (like a car lease) are allowed, though. You'll have to check with your state laws to find out if Student Loans can be put on "J".

But yes, in general you can take the last 12 months and divide by 12 to get the average... IF the last 12 months represent typical $ amounts.

[justbroke]

Yep, credit card payments do not go on Schedule J. There is something wrong with coolmom04's inclusion of the average credit card payment on the Schedule J. Unsecured debt, credit cards, will be discharged by the bankruptcy, and as such are not included as an expense item.

[momofthree]

If you've read her past posts, her dh is filing without her. Since she doesn't have a job, he is responsible for all her expenses, and they are therefore allowing him to count her debt payments on the look-forward.

I'm not sure how you came up with $150 though. Is that the regular monthly payment on all your debts when they are caught up? If so, then that is accurate. I don't think you can really go off of the past payments if they were artificially inflated due to being past due...

[justbroke]

It wouldn't be on Schedule J. It would go on Form B22A/C as a marital expense allowance, but it wouldn't show up on Schedule J, as far as I know.

[momofthree]

It wouldn't be on Schedule J. It would go on Form B22A/C as a marital expense allowance, but it wouldn't show up on Schedule J, as far as I know.

Oh, gotcha...

[justbroke]

I should probably retract that a bit. This really depends on local customs as to how that specific District deals with Schedule I's calculation of Current Monthly Income (CMI). In some District, the "non-debtor spouse" Schedule I amount is only that which is contributed towards the household expenses. Therefore, there would be no "offset" on Schedule J.

However, if your local District's rules require you to include ALL your non-debtor spouse's income on Schedule I, then you would need to specifically offset that which is NOT contributed towards household expenses.

I apologize for being so specific, but this is indeed a District specific treatment of how Schedule I and J are used for non-debtor spouse contributions.

At least in Florida, most Judges think like this

Thus, based upon the explicit language of section 101(10A), current monthly income does not include all the income of the non-debtor spouse, but rather only amounts expended on a regular basis for household expenses. (emphasis added is mine.) In Re Quarterman, Middle District of Florida

[helpmeout]

What you list on your Schedule J are the expenses you will have after you discharge the debt. Obviously, you aren't going to be able to determine what your utility costs are, but you can use the last 12 months to estimate.

My childcare for the next year is going to be more expensive than what it cost me in the last 12 months from the date of filing. My attorney had no problem with my using the numbers that I will actually pay in the coming year.


You would not put anything for the credit cards.

[SMinGA]

Listing the figures as your attorney advised should be fine.

Except you mentioned in another post you have paid your cards off... You would not include on schedule J any expenses that would exist going forward.

I personally think the trustee can argue your husband is not responsible for your debt payments - that him using your debts as a way to lessen his DMI (since he is the only filing) would be unfair to his creditors. But again, go with what your attorney says. (I obviously am not a bankruptcy atty, don't know your district, and this is just my logic.)

[coolmom04]

Yes, they are now paid off as of this month. We told our attorney this and he said it doesn't matter. What matters is what we were paying (or were supposed to be paying) for my stuff at the date of filing.

On my mom's stuff that we're paying and have to get back-up of... we hadn't really been keeping track of how much we were spending on prescriptions. I finally figured up yesterday that we spend a total of $576/month on insurance and prescriptions for her alone. We wrote down that we were paying $450.

I guess we'll just have to wait and see! I'll keep everyone posted.

Thanks for all the input.