Vehicle surrender and the timing of it all...

[TW in CO]

Just filed Ch 7 today. Will eventually surrender a pickup I'm buying through GMAC.

I kinda need to know how quickly I'll need to buy a beater to get around in. I know the automatic stay will stop a repo at least for awhile, but for how long? 1st hearing is set for 2/2.

I will be socking away some cash to buy my next crappy chariot, but putting it off as long as possible will help me a lot.

Any thoughts? Thanks in advance. I'm already 3 payments behind and they have come to the door a few weeks back to get it, but I fibbed my way out of it. Luckily had it stashed in the garage out of sight.

I can live with a repo, but I've got a bunch of tools onboard that I need every day to make a meager living. If the truck AND the tools were gone, I'd be dead....

[TW in CO]

Hey Credit Hater,

Is that one of those new Camaros by your sig???

I know my tools are exempt, but that won't do me any good if the truck disappears one day. I can hear it now - What drill? We didn't see any drills. Nail gun? Never saw it!!

You said buy a cheap truck then. When is then? Today, next week, before the creditors hearing. Thanks for the links...

[StaciMM]

The automatic stay prevents repo for now. Since it might be a week or more before the court notices reach your creditors, it would be good for you or your attorney to call the lender-give them the case #.

To proceed w/ repo they will have to file a motion and have a hearing to lift the stay, or wait for discharge. If they file a motion you should have a minimum of 2 weeks before the hearing happens.

[lostsoul23]

I've got a similiar situation going on. Although, in the time between my filing and 341, I moved to another state, and was current on the payments at the time of my move. (Not anymore, however.) I took everything out of my car and left just the owner manual in it. Not to mention I check PACER once a day to keep up on the latest w/the filings of my case. I'd take my tools out of the truck each night if I were you, or keep it locked in the garage.

[TW in CO]

I filed pro se, so all this stuff I've got to figure out myself.

I guess I could fax GMAC a copy of the Automatic Stay order, but I see it as a double edge sword. They don't seem to be too interested in the vehicle right now, but if I alert them to leave me alone for awhile, it may fire them up to get it back as soon as possible.

I guess my point is, I want to give it back, but only at the latest date possible. And if I've got cash rat-holed to buy something else, doesn't that cash become vulnerable to be grabbed by the trustee for his commissions and give to another creditor???

Thanks.

[StaciMM]

Depending on your state's allowed exemptions, cash on hand may be claimed by the trustee. If your state allows a wild card, though, you could apply that to your cash.

The automatic stay is not something the lender can choose to accept-they have to. But-if they are trying to repo and don't know about the automatic stay you can end up w/ more grief. (Yes-they'd have to bring the truck back to you, but the process could take a few days or more.) Calling them and notifying them would prevent them from coming in the middle of the night and taking it. Or taking it while you're in the grocery store, or while you're on a job site...

They'll know about the BK soon-the court will mail out notices within a few days (and add a few days for mail delivery). You just don't want them to take your truck in the meantime.

[Genenco]

I've got a similiar situation going on. Although, in the time between my filing and 341, I moved to another state, and was current on the payments at the time of my move. (Not anymore, however.) I took everything out of my car and left just the owner manual in it. Not to mention I check PACER once a day to keep up on the latest w/the filings of my case. I'd take my tools out of the truck each night if I were you, or keep it locked in the garage.

Hee hee hee..I stripped mine of EVERYTHING and left an old Beegees CD in the player...Pity they towed it, would have been fun to see the guys face as he cranked it up and their melodious (Or is that odious?) voices came wavering through the speakers!!!

[Genenco]

I filed pro se, so all this stuff I've got to figure out myself.

I guess I could fax GMAC a copy of the Automatic Stay order, but I see it as a double edge sword. They don't seem to be too interested in the vehicle right now, but if I alert them to leave me alone for awhile, it may fire them up to get it back as soon as possible. .

As Staci said. Once they have the stay order, NOTHING can they do to recover it...

I guess my point is, I want to give it back, but only at the latest date possible. And if I've got cash rat-holed to buy something else, doesn't that cash become vulnerable to be grabbed by the trustee for his commissions and give to another creditor???
Thanks.

You say you've got cash? Where? I DON'T SEE ANY!!!

Actually, what you had in the checking savings is vunerable..But that's to be decided at the 341...

I'd go start looking asap...Just to see what's out there...

[TW in CO]

Thanks Staci,

I realize that there are a number of variables here, but I have been extremely vigilant about keeping it the garage with the door closed. Watching out for who might be lurking or tailing me when I leave.

I don't think it's a high priority for them. I owe 17, it's worth about 12 and they'll probably get 5 back when they sell it at auction. It's not like I'm driving around in a loaded Hummer or Escalade...

[TW in CO]

I would have kept the BeeGee's CD. Didn't you have any Milli Vanilli CDs laying around ??

[StaciMM]

It may or may not be high priority for the lender-but if they've already assigned it for repo (and I think you said someone tried a few weeks ago) then you're nothing but a paycheck for the repo man. Generally, once its assigned only payment stops the order.

As long as its in the garage, they can't sneak it out. I don't know if this actually works-but when you must park it (store, etc.) then turn the steering wheel all the way to one side and they will have difficulty towing it...

[TW in CO]

How about if I stick a copy of the Automatic Stay on the dash where the VIN number is? I know they'll check the VIN before hauling it off.

And if they ignore it, I guess technically, they've broken some law. And maybe would be less prone to swipe my stuff out of it when they get it to the shop...

[StaciMM]

The automatic stay applies to the lender, and the lender hires the repo man. They may or may not know anything about BK or what the stay means. Even if they did, they could always trash it and claim they never saw it.

On the other hand, if you call and notify the lender by phone and then fax them notice, preferably something with confirmation, you create a papertrail. At that point, it becomes their responsibility to call off their dogs, so to say.

[Kam]

RE: Car #1:

We had an attempted repo (well a phone call) before we filed Ch7 pro se on June 20, 2005. 341 meeting was August 30. On October 10, HSBC filed for relief of stay. Last date for objections was October 30 (same day as last day for objections, period). Discharged (but not closed) on November 1, according to Pacer. We had figured our discharge date to be November 8 (based on Pacer). In July, I had received a letter from the attorney representing HSBC as to my intentions regarding the vehicle. We waffled whether to reaffirm or redeem. Decided to do a 722 redemption about a week before the end of Octorber. Finally found a dealership willing to work with the 722 redemption plan, but (le sigh) we received our discharge before we could initiate any paper work.

On November 2, I contacted HSBC's attorney to see what our options were. He stated that he had not even processed the paperwork to send back to HSBC. I would have to wait until HSBC had the paperwork before I could negotiate with them. The attorney said he was *swamped* by the number of recent discharged people and did not know when he would get the paperwork processed and sent back to HSBC.

The second week of December I received a phone call from a Repo company and I told them I was trying to negotiate with HSBC. The guy was nice and said he'd give me a couple of days. He did tell me that his company was the *third* company trying to repo the vehicle and that we had been very successful in hiding the asset. WTF? I told him I parked it in the same spot at work and in our drive way every night.

They finally came and got the car December 18th. My DH was home at the time and he watched this ratty-assed van cruise by our house, turn around and pull into our drive way. DH went outside and the woman acted real nervous. Man driving the van got out, his hand moving towards his back underneath his jacket. DH is about 6'0, 215 lbs, very muscular and black. I guess the repo peeps thought DH was about to start some stuff. DH said he folded his arms across his chest and just watched the two. The woman got into the car, started it, and took off like a bat out of hell, followed by the van. I had to laugh as DH recounted all of this. We left the car on empty.

I have NO clue why HSBC waited till the end of our BK to file for relief. In the end it took them almost 6 weeks to come get the vehicle our discharge.

Vehicles 2 and 3: (We had title loans on them and they were included in the BK). We were going to reaffirm these two, but we did not file the "official" reaffirmation agreements with the court and by the time we were notified of our error, it was close to discharge. Also, the court would only reaffirm the kbb value, not full market value (including late fees), so the court would never have approved the reaffirmation papers anyway.

November 5, 2005: We left to go to the grocery store driving car #1. We came back home to find our other two vehicles being towed. Now I knew we had been discharged, but we had not received our paperwork yet. Repo guy said he had the paperwork showing our discharge. The two men told us not to cause any shit or they would call the sheriff. The only thing I could argue is that I did not have a copy of our discharge papers. One guy said too bad and drove off with our vehicles. Vehicle 1: a car that had to be towed since the front axle needed work. Vehicle 2: our old, beloved Blazer that we had since 1992. Two hours later I received the discharge papers in the mail.

Vehicles repoed 4 days after discharge.

[Genenco]

I would have kept the BeeGee's CD. Didn't you have any Milli Vanilli CDs laying around ??

Nope, but if I had had a cassette player, I'd have left him a "Cleadus Maggard" tape...If you don't know, this guy made The White Knight amoung other Ummmm...Classics...Here's the web page....http://www.angelfire.com/ny5/andysgirl/