wilfull tort- per copy right violations?

[anykey]

How does one not fall into that category?

Ok- suppose I got a letter from an atty- and he wants all types of demands- and if I ignore it- it becomes "willful tort" and one can not bankrupt out.

A publisher thinks I sold an ebook of theirs.

The site removed the listing.

I have 10 days to respond. You may recall all the noise over download music- will now they are after those who download books.

Of course- one really should not admit- guilt.

Any thoughts?

[WhatMoney]

I suppose it depends on what the attorney is demanding. How much do they claim you owe them for selling their books? If it's a small amount you might just settle with them and promise to never do it again.

If it is enough to consider bankruptcy over, you should talk to an attorney.

[anykey]

it does not say. but something like 5k per infraction and 40k legal fees.

the key wording is "willful tort", which can not be discharged ever

[LALADY]

40K legal fees for one letter?

[car67]

Been there done that been sued for trademark case and its not dischargeable and in fact under the Lanham act if you file bankruptcy the case can be dismissed if the purpose was to avoid the penalty of the conduct described. You need to get a quick settlement and do monthly payments.....

[MSbklawyer]

Ok- suppose I got a letter from an atty- and he wants all types of demands- and if I ignore it- it becomes "willful tort" and one can not bankrupt out.

Any thoughts?

Where are you getting the "willful tort" is never dischargeable language? From that attorney's letter? That's not what the bankruptcy code says. You are reading WAY too much into it.

What the bankruptcy code doesany debt for willful and malicious injury by the debtor to another entity or to the property of another entity.potential debt. Not a debt. If my memory serves, this section only applies to actual injury. Punitives, statutory damages, attorney fees &c. don't fall within the definition of "injury". Unless you've been sued to judgment, an adversary proceeding would be needed to determine the amount of the actual debt for the actual damages --which, if you downloaded a book, would be <$1.

Now, on top of all that, a little-known fact about chapter 13 is that some things that are not dischargeable in chapter 7 areare dischargeable. That's true even if your plan ends up paying nothing to that creditor.

So, the actual damages involved here are miniscule. I believe (but I'd have to research it to be absolutely sure) that only the actual damages are nondischargeable in chapter 7. Even the actual damages are dischargeable in chapter 13.

[anykey]

Broadcast Music, Inc v. Leisure properties, Inc, 1978 US Dist. Lexus 14312 (N.D. Ohio 1978) debt would remain- plus interest.

so their attorney claims.

"copyright infringement is a willful tort".

The letter says that if I do not reply in 10 days- they consider that bad faith and will sue.

I should note that a simple search came up with 12 sites where the one book- (they claim a batch) is online and there to take for free. In fact- all the books I own I got for free. Being that they are pretty widespread- this seems to be public domain- ...since the public has by virtue of 100s of thousands of downloads- put it there.

The letter is like- well you are guilty- it says I will lose in court.

They demand financial compensation- yet- that amount is blank.

They also want me to provide them with all my records- or they will subpoena them.

[BKDefender]

anykey,
It's our job to scare people into paying money to our clients for a claim our client says is valid and we have researched and looks legitimate. It's advocacy on the part of our client's interests. If the book says 'copyright' then you are put on notice that it is copyrighted and any distribution could be considered willful.
Having said that, if a client of mine wanted me to file a lawsuit against someone for copyright violation for selling a few e-books, and that person had just filed bankruptcy, I would advise that they not waste their time.
I have a case where we're suing a business for screwing my sole proprietor client out of about $40k in actual costs to remodel a leased location and then they wrongfully evicted them -and committed all kinds of fraud in the process. That one we're pursuing even through the businesses chapter 11 BK case. It's been strange being on the creditor side, but it's still a David v. Goliath type case that I like.

--William

[anykey]

BK, Do I respond to this letter?

I was thinking of sending certified letter- that acknowledges the letter they sent. But offering no promises or info. Sorta like pleading the 5th.

I do not want to phone or email. It sounds like anything I offer will not be enough.

If I delete the ebay ID- then I then would get people wanting refunds. As it turns out "distributing" the material is still a violation.

I could ignore it. ..but suppose this goes to a judgment= and then i file a 7- which I plan to at some point...then they dispute the discharge of their lien= the only way I have anything is if I have a return receipt certified letter. I don't think the judge would accept- me saying- I called and emailed them.

I note that on a search- a few said even after they played ball- the lawyers still insisted on $500 or more.

What I can do- is stop anything that is this type of activity. They informed me in writing- so- of course they will be watching.

I notice that they sue alot of people including Google for Google putting books online.

I don't know if my home owner ins covers this.


They seem to think I am a college kid. When I am pushing age 50.

I seen that GATT is what made a bunch of the IP law. I never signed the GATT agreement.

I get the impression ebay easily plays ball with these people. Paypal- tho- might be tougher...even tho they are same owner.

This IP thing is a question of our generation. There is not a whole large amount of percent yet. Not per ebooks.

The very essence of the Internet IS to share data. If no new data came on- the net would die off... as outdated data is of little use.

In away I do not feel bad- on what the industry charged for text books and the like.

So then the question is how far do they go. A random guy who did a few $100 then stops... or the China/India production factory outlets?

Lawyers to not work for free. Filing papers too have costs.

Basically the business model is changing. That is much bigger then me and my infraction. They could extraordinary rendition me, water board me, billergant combatant me; and the practice in the real world that things are changing continue.
......it was ok- that peons jobs were outsourced or automated- but now big business wants to stop its function from being outmoded.

Not that I am totally with out blame here. It is frustrating tho- that a peon needs a law degree to function.

Were the Intellectual property of bextra, nerontin, celebrex, thalidomide, safe?? How about the GMO corn that causes organ failure? How about that corporations can trademark your personal DNA? The court ruled that corporations have 1st amendment right. A life form can even be patented. ..laws apply only to the peons... not the big corporations. Rxs could be imported from Canada- you know NAFTA, and free trade is good- right? Well don't you the peon try it. Free trade does not apply to YOU.

As long as we have the world class university system- filled with the best and the brightest... this "intellectual property", who do I sue for the economic collapse? Surely someone owns this.

....I know my rant is extraneous. Oh well.

[BKDefender]

They sent you the letter via US Mail so they know where you live. You could send them a letter stating that I received their letter and confirming that they have your residence address correct, and that's it.
Then if they sued you, they would have to personally serve you at your residence. It does no good to avoid service of process - all they have to do is provide affidavits showing their attempts at service and the court will allow them to publish the summons and they'll get a default against you and garnish your wages.

If you know about the lawsuit, you can file bankruptcy when you're sued to stop the lawsuit.

I expect that their business model is to threaten to get settlements, but not to sue. It's too easy to take the path of least resistance. The same way a car thief steals the car without the alarm instead of the car with the alarm. Same $$$, less effort.

--William

[JackBondLove]

I am confused as to what exactly you did. Did you download an E-book, and then offer it for sale on Ebay?

[anykey]

I am confused as to what exactly you did. Did you download an E-book, and then offer it for sale on Ebay?

Yes.

[anykey]

They sent you the letter via US Mail so they know where you live. You could send them a letter stating that I received their letter and confirming that they have your residence address correct, and that's it.
Then if they sued you, they would have to personally serve you at your residence. It does no good to avoid service of process - all they have to do is provide affidavits showing their attempts at service and the court will allow them to publish the summons and they'll get a default against you and garnish your wages.

If you know about the lawsuit, you can file bankruptcy when you're sued to stop the lawsuit.

I expect that their business model is to threaten to get settlements, but not to sue. It's too easy to take the path of least resistance. The same way a car thief steals the car without the alarm instead of the car with the alarm. Same $$$, less effort.

--William

I am in PA which does not have wage attachments for all but tax- student loans and child support. Aside from that I am not employed- I am on Soc Sec..

They mispelled my name. and it was not in caps. Should I send the letter to their atty or the corporate CEO?

I own a modest house- with the bank- and there is a large judgment on me already.

[BKOnce]

1. If you download just to use/read/study their copyrighted material WITHOUT selling it for profits then it is NON_COMMERCIAL purpose, and/or non-profit and/or educational purposes, then they will not pursue you.

But once you cross that threshold (redistributing their works and/or reselling for your own profits, then you have violated US Federal Copyright law -> meaning that you steal someone else's IP works, mental ideas/creations, and/or profits from someone else's IP works by profiting their own ideas/inventions to the general public THUS COMPETING COMMERCIALLY WITH THEMSELVES).

It is different from your OTHER buying and/or selling you personal items on eBay (cars, TV, electronics, clothes, etc.) where you are entitled to owning solely that products and no one else!.. so you can do away or dispose whatever way you want.

[anykey]

1. If you download just to use/read/study their copyrighted material WITHOUT selling it for profits then it is NON_COMMERCIAL purpose, and/or non-profit and/or educational purposes, then they will not pursue you.

But once you cross that threshold (redistributing their works and/or reselling for your own profits, then you have violated US Federal Copyright law -> meaning that you steal someone else's IP works, mental ideas/creations, and/or profits from someone else's IP works by profiting their own ideas/inventions to the general public THUS COMPETING COMMERCIALLY WITH THEMSELVES).

It is different from your OTHER buying and/or selling you personal items on eBay (cars, TV, electronics, clothes, etc.) where you are entitled to owning solely that products and no one else!.. so you can do away or dispose whatever way you want.

So as a result- the grid should turn off my chip?

In effect- canceling the ability to pay the heat bill, electric- to own a car, a house, and this punishment extends beyond 7 years- for the entire rest of my life. So that I can not use a bank to pay bills- and the sheriff will auction off my furniture and personal effects. Forever.

Lifelong

maybe I could go on section 8 and have free public housing.

Not for 3 years - but for 99 years- or until I die.

Gosh- some murderers get out sooner then life.

Clearly property trumps human life.

Gosh- what a lovely world.

It would be easier to take a whole bottle of pills and carbon monoxide myself.

Serious crimes like this- should be forever- no statute of limitations.

But then this IS a product of the best and the brightest society that we become.

Who knew?