Letter from Law Firm 6 Months After Discharge

[Amy26]

Hi, today I received a letter from a law firm representing Kay Jewelers. I was discharged in September 2009 and Kay had sent me a reaffirmation agreement on my husband and my wedding rings. We did not reaffirm the debt and nothing was contested in the discharge.

So, here today I get a letter dated February 1st from a law firm representing Kay saying they are demanding that I return the collateral to them immediately.

Can they do this so long after the discharge? Can I just ignore it? Are they just hoping that I will freak out and send it to them?

I know people were getting letters like this from Best Buy demanding goods returned but that was during their bankruptcies before they were discharged. I am wondering what recourse these guys have being that its been so long since I was discharged?

Thanks.

[BCA2009]

It's a shame you sold them a few months after your discharge.

Seriously, I would ignore the letter. Make them get a court order to repo the rings. Unlike a car, they can't take them in the middle of the night. Unless you have some really expensive rings they aren't going to spend any money going to court to force you to hand over the jewelry. They are just hoping you will voluntarily turn them over.

[Amy26]

What do you mean its a shame I sold them a few months after my discharge? Sold what?

No the rings weren't extravagent... I think the total we bk'd was like 2,200 or 2,500. I had made 1 payment on them before we filed.

[AngelinaCat]

Hi Amy26: Send a nice letter to them with a copy of the discharge order, front and back, and inform them that they are in serious violation of the law since you were discharged and no one contested before the 60 days were up.

Also send a courtesy copy to your trustee and your judge, and your attorney if you used one. Chances are that will shut them up.

Good luck!

[BCA2009]

What do you mean its a shame I sold them a few months after my discharge? Sold what?
No the rings weren't extravagent... I think the total we bk'd was like 2,200 or 2,500. I had made 1 payment on them before we filed.

That was an attempt at humor (obviously a very poor attempt). I was saying had you already "Sold" them. Then you wouldn't have them to give back. It was only a poor joke. I was not encouraging anyone to lie.

Back to you original question. I just can't imagine them spending the dollars to take you to court to get them back. Because you only made one payment, they may have had an opportunity to prevail in an AP. But they would have had to do that before your discharge.

If it was me, I would ignore them.A $2,200 retail ring is worth about $300 (or less) if you tried to sell it. It's just not worth there time.

[BCA2009]

Hi Amy26: Send a nice letter to them with a copy of the discharge order, front and back, and inform them that they are in serious violation of the law since you were discharged and no one contested before the 60 days were up.

Also send a courtesy copy to your trustee and your judge, and your attorney if you used one. Chances are that will shut them up.

Good luck!

If it was a secured item, couldn't Kay's Jewelers legitimately ask for the rings to be returned? I know they couldn't ask for money, but would it be violation to ask for secured property back?

[Amy26]

Well the original price was not 2,500... it was worth a lot more but with discounts and I turned in a valuable earring to get another discount to get the amount charged to my card to around 2,500.

The rings were retail value more than that.

Angelina, are they really in violation? The letter they sent me even acknowledges that I have been discharged...this is exactly what it says:

My client holds a purchase money security interest in the items purchased through Sterling Inc. dba KAY JEWELERS. You made purchases and did not reaffirm the obligation and have now received a discharge. We are demanding that you promptly return the collateral. Please phone me at xxx-xxx-xxxx to make the necessary arrangements.

[Dst1]

If it was a secured item, couldn't Kay's Jewelers legitimately ask for the rings to be returned? I know they couldn't ask for money, but would it be violation to ask for secured property back?

Edit. Missed your reply Amy26.

What was the nature of your agreement with Kay? It sounds to me like there was some paper you signed with Kay (the entire amount was not put on the CC). In that case it is more like a house or car. In that situation they could repossess it.

[BCA2009]

Kay could legally ask for a lot of things. During the BK process. Not after.

So if you don't re-affirm you car, the bank can't repo it after BK. I think the OP should ignore the letter and they will go away, but I think they do have a legitimate claim on the property.

[Dst1]

So if you don't re-affirm you car, the bank can't repo it after BK. I think the OP should ignore the letter and they will go away, but I think they do have a legitimate claim on the property.

I was confused about what was happening with the ring which is why I edited my reply.

[keepmine]

Kay could legally ask for a lot of things. During the BK process. Not after.

If they hold a security interest and are not asking for money there is no violation.
I'd just ignore the letter and see what they do. I doubt they'e going to go the trouble to get a writ of replevin to force you to return the rings.

[AngelinaCat]

If it was a secured item, couldn't Kay's Jewelers legitimately ask for the rings to be returned? I know they couldn't ask for money, but would it be violation to ask for secured property back?

I found this article:

http://library.findlaw.com/2000/Sep/1/127970.html

which talks about the various chapters and the types of things that aren't discharged and so forth. I put the conclusion of the article here, but the highlighted part may or may not apply. Did you use an attorney?

"Conclusion

The discharge of debt varies under the different chapters of bankruptcy. Certain chapters allow for a more liberal discharge of debt than others, but requires greater payment by the debtor before discharge. The effect of the discharge, however, is the same. The debtor is no longer liable for those discharged obligations and creditors are forbidden to pursue payment from the debtor. Creditors do have collection options, however, especially when they plan carefully before bankruptcy is filed. To best evaluate the effect of bankruptcy discharge on you as a debtor or creditor, seek the counsel of an experienced bankruptcy attorney."

[AngelinaCat]

Here is another article from Moran Law that might give a better explanation, particularly the second paragraph of the section on 'Permanent Injunction'.

http://www.moranlaw.net/discharge.htm

[Amy26]

Edit. Missed your reply Amy26.

What was the nature of your agreement with Kay? It sounds to me like there was some paper you signed with Kay (the entire amount was not put on the CC). In that case it is more like a house or car. In that situation they could repossess it.

Hi, umm not sure what you mean about signing anything... we basically went in when they were having a big sale. The rings we wanted were like 30% off that day or something.

I also had an expensive earring that I used in trade-in or downpayment which knocked off another grand or so.

Other than that, the only thing I signed was the warrenty information and the credit card slip. I think (I can't seem to find any old statements) the total on the card was like 2,700 (just checked my petition) with 12 payments of 225 or something.

I'm assuming that Kay Jewelers is much like Best Buy... where in their credit card agreement disclosures or what not they state that the items are a secured property or something.

I did use a lawyer, and I sent him an email about this...but he has a bad habit as viewing me as a "case closed" and not paying attention to me on anything I have asked him since my case was closed.

[AngelinaCat]

You may need to go camp in that attorney's office until you get an answer.