Absolutely BRUTAL 341-Florida Middle

[DeadManCrawling]

Hi, JR,

We were running 45 minutes behind when we finished, as well. Our attorney had one other client there, who was the last case before lunch.

I was glad she was the last one, as she was terribly nervous about this. I think our attorney may have asked a personal favor to make her the last before lunch. As such, she was in the room alone, everyone else gone, including us. Only our attorney and the trustee were present. If our attorney DID request this, I am even more impressed with him.

There are a few other memories I will try to post as I think of them.

We watched around 15-18 cases.

The trustee ordered appraisals for personal or business assets in almost all of them. We were one of 2-3 that did not receive an appraisal order.

With the appraisals, there seemed to be some common things: near or over median income, retaining house, large house, or some other questions about exemptions or assets. Though she wanted appraisals on all these cases, there seemed to be reasons underlying each one.

[marie]

LRPRN,

When we started, I was a bundle of nerves, about to explode, terrified to get out of bed in the morning.

-dmc

This just about describes me at the moment. I can't sleep well, wake up in the early hours with waves of panic rushing over me.

I feel like crying, but face my family each day with a smile and a calm countenance, because I am their rock, and they need me to be strong.

we are filing personal chapter 7 soon, but we are self employed, and I am terrified that the trustee will want to take my husbands truck and tools, and money in the business account that I use as working funds for payroll and daily expenses.

If I get a check for a job that is $8000 , for example, I might have paid out already $6000 in wages, expenses, WC, insurance etc, and that money coming in covers the next job. I can't just spend it, and if the trustee took it, then we could not operate.

I just wish all this was over, I just feel so uncertain.

on a brighter note, I hope everyone has a pleasant and peaceful holiday season, whatever your faith, and congratulations to all those whose cases have been concluded with a satisfactory result

[frogger]

Congratulations DMC. It's amazing how some think that they are smarter than the trustee or are going to game the system. I'm glad yours went well.

And for those others that tried to play the trustee, they're going to find out that stupidity can be painful.

60 days and counting!

[DeadManCrawling]

Marie,

Keep reading and learning, have patience with yourself, and most of all, do NOT try to hurry to file without full understanding of what you are doing. You'd be amazed how much time you MAY have. Three years, for us.

I know more about BK than I imagined possible, from time spent researching, on this forum, and so on.

You will get through, somehow, someway. Just as we did. Study your exemptions, and prepare and you will be able to keep everything in tact that you need. Need, not want. THere is a difference, and I took a little longer than the average to understand that part, I think.

[nickifan]

Congrats, DMC!! But you are a grinch for scaring us with that title!!

I do hope Armani Man goes down in flames. He's poster boy for why Congress tightened up the BK rules in 2005.

I'm still interviewing attorneys, but I do ask them if "all the dozen Ch 7 trustees know and love them madly"...sort of jokingly but to see how they respond. All said they get along with everyone, and one told me there is a "well-feared one" (sounds like yours but I'm in TX) but that said trustee "loves his firm" because their paperwork is always in order. Other two said in effect they just make extra extra sure they dot i's and cross t's if they pull this guy...3rd atty actually told me his name and how he tries to gauge the trustee's case load (or something like that) when he's about to file for someone. I even asked if the lawyer can immediately "unfile" (claim some mistake or whatever) if they pull this guy and of course the answer is no....
My personality is such that I will fret constantly that I'll get this meanie!!

Anyway...you and your family have a MerriER Christmas than you might have imagined before the 341!

[marie]

I have talked with an attorney, and I am so uptight, but he seemed to think It would not be problematic. Actually I have spoken with 3, and the last one specializes in Business law and asset protection. I went with him.

He told me that the trustees and court clerks love to work with his paralegal lady assistant because she knows exactly what to do and the forms are always submitted just the way they want them

[JRScott]

Congrats, DMC!! But you are a grinch for scaring us with that title!!

I do hope Armani Man goes down in flames. He's poster boy for why Congress tightened up the BK rules in 2005.

I'm still interviewing attorneys, but I do ask them if "all the dozen Ch 7 trustees know and love them madly"...sort of jokingly but to see how they respond. All said they get along with everyone, and one told me there is a "well-feared one" (sounds like yours but I'm in TX) but that said trustee "loves his firm" because their paperwork is always in order. Other two said in effect they just make extra extra sure they dot i's and cross t's if they pull this guy...3rd atty actually told me his name and how he tries to gauge the trustee's case load (or something like that) when he's about to file for someone. I even asked if the lawyer can immediately "unfile" (claim some mistake or whatever) if they pull this guy and of course the answer is no....
My personality is such that I will fret constantly that I'll get this meanie!!

Anyway...you and your family have a MerriER Christmas than you might have imagined before the 341!

Trustees are assigned by rotation order in most districts so yes if you know that a case might be borderline you can file it such that you don't get the hardnosed one , or at least are prepared for it.

[seth]

great story! let me tell you how my 341 unfolded...it was literally 2 minutes...give or take 30 seconds

my appt was at 3:30pm. I arrived with the wife, my lawyer arrived 5 minutes later at 3:15. the LINE was sooooooooooooo LONG it was like a zoo. at around 5:15 (15 minutes before closing), the trustee called us in. tape recorder on, asked as a series of questions. she did it so fast that i was stuttering to say the yes and no's.....then she smiled at us and said youre done and good luck to you guys...

[dakota112]

It seems to me that if the Bk Court wanted to cut down on Fraud, they should impose a more intimidating Venue. There should be posted at the 341 meeting a digital sign updated daily with the number of folks incarcerated that week, mont, and year in that district for committing fraud. I think that would make people think twice about hindering or delaying the process. I do wonder if the US is truly capable of incarcerating people who lie about the value of their assets or hide money etc especially with all the hard core criminals who are currently on our streets that they cannot afford to incarcerate or do not have the will to do so. Such as repeat sex offenders, bank robbers, thieves, arsonists and on and on. Might be that when it comes to money , justice is more important than assault and battery on our citizens. What gets me the most about this whole process is that it seems so arbitrary anyway ( TT or UST personality dependent). In the end it is not just us, but the whole country that is bankrupt. Is there a world court with a world trustee that will preside over the US when it defaults on all of its debt?

[DeadManCrawling]

In the Tampa 341 room there is a sign.

It is massive, menacing, and looms over the trustee's shoulder, directly into your corneas.

Here is an approximation of what it reads:

THE FBI PROSECUTES BANKRUPTCY FRAUD.

Below that is a list of penalties and sanctions. I cannot recall all the words, but it was very intimidating. Not as good as the above digital sign idea. That would be cool, to see it update every few minutes as another joker got hauled off to meet new friends and lovers.

Even as it was, I cannot imagine looking at the trustee beneath that sign and trying to conceal assets. Pure greed, stupidity, arrogance and ignorance.

Best,

-dmc

[Fresh]

Pure Greed and Sense of Entitlement

DMC,

Congratulations to you and thanks for sharing this great information.

What you said about the man in the Armani suit applies to what is doing this country in big time: pure greed and a sense of entitlement with NOTHING to back it up.

[Widdle]

Wow --- and Stay off Pacer!

Wow, didn't know that the Tampa Division was so hellbent on appraisals.

That 341 meeting was nerve racking, I started reading your post yesterday and had to close it halfway down.

341's like that scares me.

Good thing the courthouses scan for weapons!!

Anyway, congrats on your 341 and try to stay off Pacer.

[danaf]

Huge Congrats! Nothing better than thorough preparation and I'd say 3 yrs worth is more than thorough. Enjoy your discharge & new beginning.

[DivorceRuinedMe]

I also filed Middle District of FL and I think I had this same trustee. Were her initials SSJ?

[DeadManCrawling]

I cannot remember her initials, now, strangely.

That sounds familiar.

She was a rather severe looking woman with dirty-blonde hair and a very stern attitude. Rightfully so, in a few cases.

Amazing what people were trying to get away with.

I will look tomorrow and see if I wrote her name down. I won't post it, of course, but may be able to confirm.

In fact, we were planning on going back Monday to watch the second part of Armani Man's 341, to see what happens. We were pretty interested in that unfolding mess.

Best,

-dmc