Florida chapter 7 questions

[blackomega]

Hello, im in FL and am looking to file Chpt 7 shortly and I have some questions I hope you good folks can assist with. My decision to file was finalized this weekend when I was served a summons for a CC lawsuit.

First some quick facts, I am a homeowner (me and the bank) house is slightly upside down but I am looking to keep it, my name only on the home since I got married after I bought it. I have 2 children with her, we've been together 16 yrs but married 4, no divorce on the horizon. I have 2 cars, both paid for. A 2000 chevy worth about $1620.00 titled as me AND her, and a 2000 Ford worth about $1495.00 titled in me OR her. The values were based on blue book private sale. She refuses to jointly file and with no cards or debt in her name i'm fine with that but nothing will budge that decision. In the next couple of weeks I will meet with a BK attorney for a consult but I cant afford to hire one, unfortunately nothing can change this fact so i am stuck pro se. So until I can get a consultation I would appreciate any insight to settle my nerves until then. With those particulars out of the way here are my questions:

1) Do I have to list everything I own down to my socks and how do I seperate what she owns? IF what she owns is even protected.

2) What happens with the cars? I think it would be a little too late to remove my name from hers a month before I file.

3) I have read a few posts and it seems I will only get the 1k vehicle exemption and the 1k wildcard since I seem to have to exempt the house, even though its underwater. I take it thats true?

4) Lastly since we are not both filing what about the kids belongings not to mention hers?

[aljohnson007]

Florida Statute 689.11 provides an exception to simultaneous title in the case of married persons owning real property as tenants by entireties. Florida Statute 689.11 provides that if one spouse owns a property in his own name and conveys the property by deed to both spouses the conveyance creates an estate by the entirety. However, bring this up when you consult with the attorneys. If you can get this done, you should be able to exempt the house and all personal property under TBE.

[aljohnson007]

As for the lawsuit, don't ignore it. File a response within the time limits allowed, dispute the charges and demand:

- A detailed accounting of how the amount claimed was determined.

- A copy of each and every charge that validates the amount claimed to include the signature of the person initiating the charge.

This can buy you some time and may cause the lawsuit to be dropped.

[aljohnson007]

Thought of another item that may lead you in the right direction.

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_hb6367/is_7_73/ai_n28734664/

http://pacer.flmb.uscourts.gov/pdf-new/60045750.pdf

[2Bshinyandnew]

hello, im in fl and am looking to file chpt 7 shortly and i have some questions i hope you good folks can assist with. My decision to file was finalized this weekend when i was served a summons for a cc lawsuit.

First some quick facts, i am a homeowner (me and the bank) house is slightly upside down but i am looking to keep it, my name only on the home since i got married after i bought it. I have 2 children with her, we've been together 16 yrs but married 4, no divorce on the horizon. I have 2 cars, both paid for. A 2000 chevy worth about $1620.00 titled as me and her, and a 2000 ford worth about $1495.00 titled in me or her. The values were based on blue book private sale. She refuses to jointly file and with no cards or debt in her name i'm fine with that but nothing will budge that decision. In the next couple of weeks i will meet with a bk attorney for a consult but i cant afford to hire one, unfortunately nothing can change this fact so i am stuck pro se. So until i can get a consultation i would appreciate any insight to settle my nerves until then. With those particulars out of the way here are my questions:

1) do i have to list everything i own down to my socks and how do i seperate what she owns? If what she owns is even protected.

most petitions i have seen list items in categories, like,
wearing apparal - $200
living room furniture - $300
kitchen - $100

and so on

2) what happens with the cars? I think it would be a little too late to remove my name from hers a month before i file.

a car titled in both spouses names (tenants by the entirety) should exempt the non-filing spouses share of interest in the auto. The and/or wording of the title is the same. The attorney my ex used said that my 1/2 of a $2000 vehicle titled with that lovely "or" qualifier could be claimed as exempt using florida statute 689.11. In the case of a vehicle that is worth a lot more, i'm not sure what would happen but based on the #'s you provided you should be ok. It would be a lot easier if you both filed to keep both cars since your exemptions are doubled but as long as the wife knows that you may have to come up with some $$$ to keep the nonexempt portion of one vehicle, which in this case doesn't seem like a whole lot, you should be fine.
DO NOT do any title changes at this point. None.


3) i have read a few posts and it seems i will only get the 1k vehicle exemption and the 1k wildcard since i seem to have to exempt the house, even though its underwater. I take it thats true?

yes. This is true. The only way to increase your exemptions is to claim, on your petition, that you do not intend to keep your homestead property. If you claim you intend to keep the property, even if you are underwater, you cannot claim the florida $4000 personal property exemption for filers that cannot/do not claim the benefit of a homestead exemption.

As long as you are current on your mortgage at the time of filing you may be able to change your mind after filing and choose to keep your homestead. For this, i would check with a lawyer because planning ahead to do this may not be a good idea. That said, if you are underwater, why do you want to keep the property?

4) lastly since we are not both filing what about the kids belongings not to mention hers?

i'm not sure exactly how to list this on your petition, but it shouldn't be a huge issue. Something like : Clothing/belongings for children - $100. (garage sale value)

not a lawyer

[blackomega]

Originally Posted by blackomega
hello, im in fl and am looking to file chpt 7 shortly and i have some questions i hope you good folks can assist with. My decision to file was finalized this weekend when i was served a summons for a cc lawsuit.

First some quick facts, i am a homeowner (me and the bank) house is slightly upside down but i am looking to keep it, my name only on the home since i got married after i bought it. I have 2 children with her, we've been together 16 yrs but married 4, no divorce on the horizon. I have 2 cars, both paid for. A 2000 chevy worth about $1620.00 titled as me and her, and a 2000 ford worth about $1495.00 titled in me or her. The values were based on blue book private sale. She refuses to jointly file and with no cards or debt in her name i'm fine with that but nothing will budge that decision. In the next couple of weeks i will meet with a bk attorney for a consult but i cant afford to hire one, unfortunately nothing can change this fact so i am stuck pro se. So until i can get a consultation i would appreciate any insight to settle my nerves until then. With those particulars out of the way here are my questions:

1) do i have to list everything i own down to my socks and how do i seperate what she owns? If what she owns is even protected.

most petitions i have seen list items in categories, like,
wearing apparal - $200
living room furniture - $300
kitchen - $100
and so on

OK, this makes sense, do we still use garage sale prices?

2) what happens with the cars? I think it would be a little too late to remove my name from hers a month before i file.

a car titled in both spouses names (tenants by the entirety) should exempt the non-filing spouses share of interest in the auto. The and/or wording of the title is the same. The attorney my ex used said that my 1/2 of a $2000 vehicle titled with that lovely "or" qualifier could be claimed as exempt using florida statute 689.11. In the case of a vehicle that is worth a lot more, i'm not sure what would happen but based on the #'s you provided you should be ok. It would be a lot easier if you both filed to keep both cars since your exemptions are doubled but as long as the wife knows that you may have to come up with some $$$ to keep the nonexempt portion of one vehicle, which in this case doesn't seem like a whole lot, you should be fine.
DO NOT do any title changes at this point. None.

OK, so tell me if this is correct then, say we're talking about the Chevy which is basically her car that worth $1620.00, my interest in it is 810.00? And as such I would exempt that? In that case what about the Ford?

3) i have read a few posts and it seems i will only get the 1k vehicle exemption and the 1k wildcard since i seem to have to exempt the house, even though its underwater. I take it thats true?

yes. This is true. The only way to increase your exemptions is to claim, on your petition, that you do not intend to keep your homestead property. If you claim you intend to keep the property, even if you are underwater, you cannot claim the florida $4000 personal property exemption for filers that cannot/do not claim the benefit of a homestead exemption.

As long as you are current on your mortgage at the time of filing you may be able to change your mind after filing and choose to keep your homestead. For this, i would check with a lawyer because planning ahead to do this may not be a good idea. That said, if you are underwater, why do you want to keep the property?

Thanks for confirming that, I want to keep the house becuse while we are underwater (by only about 10K) we have a very low fixed rate and love the house and location.

4) lastly since we are not both filing what about the kids belongings not to mention hers?

i'm not sure exactly how to list this on your petition, but it shouldn't be a huge issue. Something like : Clothing/belongings for children - $100. (garage sale value)

OK, so kids stuff has to be listed, what about her stuff since she is not filing, ALOT of it really IS hers, this is a major concern.

[blackomega]

As for the lawsuit, don't ignore it. File a response within the time limits allowed, dispute the charges and demand:

- A detailed accounting of how the amount claimed was determined.

- A copy of each and every charge that validates the amount claimed to include the signature of the person initiating the charge.

This can buy you some time and may cause the lawsuit to be dropped.

The first thing I got was a pretrial conference summons, no 30 day response period. Checked the docket on my county's clerk site and thats exactly what shows, they filed end of aug, I was served with pretrial summons.

Thanks!

[aljohnson007]

This sounds like a small claims suit which in Florida, both parties must attend a mediation conference. If it is not settled there, then a trial date is set. I would not admit to anything and even if they had all the receipts, tell them you need time to research your records. Is it the original creditor or a collection agency?

[blackomega]

This sounds like a small claims suit which in Florida, both parties must attend a mediation conference. If it is not settled there, then a trial date is set. I would not admit to anything and even if they had all the receipts, tell them you need time to research your records. Is it the original creditor or a collection agency?

Zakheim (sp?) and associates, they seem to be suing for the creditor or they may be a JDB either way I want to file and get it going. My big questions now are as I said above, How does her interest vs my interest in the cars work and what about all of her property. Thanks for all your help!!!!!!

[blackomega]

Originally Posted by blackomega
hello, im in fl and am looking to file chpt 7 shortly and i have some questions i hope you good folks can assist with. My decision to file was finalized this weekend when i was served a summons for a cc lawsuit.

First some quick facts, i am a homeowner (me and the bank) house is slightly upside down but i am looking to keep it, my name only on the home since i got married after i bought it. I have 2 children with her, we've been together 16 yrs but married 4, no divorce on the horizon. I have 2 cars, both paid for. A 2000 chevy worth about $1620.00 titled as me and her, and a 2000 ford worth about $1495.00 titled in me or her. The values were based on blue book private sale. She refuses to jointly file and with no cards or debt in her name i'm fine with that but nothing will budge that decision. In the next couple of weeks i will meet with a bk attorney for a consult but i cant afford to hire one, unfortunately nothing can change this fact so i am stuck pro se. So until i can get a consultation i would appreciate any insight to settle my nerves until then. With those particulars out of the way here are my questions:

1) do i have to list everything i own down to my socks and how do i seperate what she owns? If what she owns is even protected.

most petitions i have seen list items in categories, like,
wearing apparal - $200
living room furniture - $300
kitchen - $100
and so on

OK, this makes sense, do we still use garage sale prices?

2) what happens with the cars? I think it would be a little too late to remove my name from hers a month before i file.

a car titled in both spouses names (tenants by the entirety) should exempt the non-filing spouses share of interest in the auto. The and/or wording of the title is the same. The attorney my ex used said that my 1/2 of a $2000 vehicle titled with that lovely "or" qualifier could be claimed as exempt using florida statute 689.11. In the case of a vehicle that is worth a lot more, i'm not sure what would happen but based on the #'s you provided you should be ok. It would be a lot easier if you both filed to keep both cars since your exemptions are doubled but as long as the wife knows that you may have to come up with some $$$ to keep the nonexempt portion of one vehicle, which in this case doesn't seem like a whole lot, you should be fine.
DO NOT do any title changes at this point. None.

OK, so tell me if this is correct then, say we're talking about the Chevy which is basically her car that worth $1620.00, my interest in it is 810.00? And as such I would exempt that? In that case what about the Ford?

3) i have read a few posts and it seems i will only get the 1k vehicle exemption and the 1k wildcard since i seem to have to exempt the house, even though its underwater. I take it thats true?

yes. This is true. The only way to increase your exemptions is to claim, on your petition, that you do not intend to keep your homestead property. If you claim you intend to keep the property, even if you are underwater, you cannot claim the florida $4000 personal property exemption for filers that cannot/do not claim the benefit of a homestead exemption.

As long as you are current on your mortgage at the time of filing you may be able to change your mind after filing and choose to keep your homestead. For this, i would check with a lawyer because planning ahead to do this may not be a good idea. That said, if you are underwater, why do you want to keep the property?

Thanks for confirming that, I want to keep the house becuse while we are underwater (by only about 10K) we have a very low fixed rate and love the house and location.

4) lastly since we are not both filing what about the kids belongings not to mention hers?

i'm not sure exactly how to list this on your petition, but it shouldn't be a huge issue. Something like : Clothing/belongings for children - $100. (garage sale value)

OK, so kids stuff has to be listed, what about her stuff since she is not filing, ALOT of it really IS hers, this is a major concern.

I have been searching the forums and cant find any information to answer these questions. Again I appreciate everyones help!

[blackomega]

Sorry to ask again but I am still confused on these 2 points:

I understand that even though I am filing singley the kids stuff has to be listed? What about her stuff since she is not filing, ALOT of it really IS hers, this is a major concern.

AND

Am I correct in thinking the following? Lets say we're talking about the Chevy which is basically her car thats worth $1620.00, my interest in it is 810.00? And as such I would exempt that? If thats the case what about the Ford?

[2Bshinyandnew]

Sorry to ask again but I am still confused on these 2 points:

I understand that even though I am filing singley the kids stuff has to be listed? What about her stuff since she is not filing, ALOT of it really IS hers, this is a major concern.

AND

Am I correct in thinking the following? Lets say we're talking about the Chevy which is basically her car thats worth $1620.00, my interest in it is 810.00? And as such I would exempt that? If thats the case what about the Ford?

When my ex filed, with an attorney, he did not list the kids stuff. At all. He just did a room-by-room listing. Unless you have very valuable jewelry or art that has an extra insurance rider on it, it really isn't that big of a deal. Hundreds of CH7's are filed every day in my district and I haven't heard of anyone really having problems fitting in the allowed $1000 personal property exemptions, regardless of filing status. Perhaps you could open up a PACER account and take a look at some petitions that have been discharged? It may cost a few bucks, but, if it helps...

If you are not filing jointly with your spouse, you will only get 1 $1000 auto exemption, regardless of how titled. The way I understand it an exemption claimed on a petition can be done a number of ways as far as how it is listed, the value, and which corresponding statute is used to claim the exemption. When it comes to jointly titled automobiles in a single-filers petition, the best way to know how to do this is by consulting an attorney who knows how the court/trustee typically likes to see these type of exemptions listed. This can vary from district to district, trustee to trustee. When my ex filed he got a very easy-going trustee and his attorney felt confident in listing his exemptions in a less formal way. Had he been assigned a different trustee, the exemption, lets say, his automobile exemption, might have been listed differently, utilizing say, NADA values vs. KBB. The filers interest in a jointly titled asset may be listed in a couple of different ways; a 50/50 split of the value, TBE (Tenants by the Entirety).

I think the answers you are looking for can really only be answered with any certainty by an attorney. Even then, you may get 3 different opinions. My ex was able to claim 100% of his vehicle because he abondoned a homestead exemption and fit the amount over $1000 in with the $4000 for non-homestead filers. Had he not abandoned his homestead, the attorney said he would have listed 50% of the value as exempt using the statute listed above by a previous poster. Now, I had thought that it should have been 100%, but the attorney insisted otherwise. Luckily, you are not dealing with a huge amount of money here. A few attorney consults and the NOLO press book should give you more definitive answers.

[blackomega]

When you mentioned insurance rider I just realized I had a couple guns on my homeowners insurance that I sold late last year, I completely forgot to take them off the insurance. What kind of issues would that cause since I havent even owned them for almost a year? It was only $30.00 extra bucks on my homeowners so it completely slipped my mind.

[2Bshinyandnew]

When you mentioned insurance rider I just realized I had a couple guns on my homeowners insurance that I sold late last year, I completely forgot to take them off the insurance. What kind of issues would that cause since I havent even owned them for almost a year? It was only $30.00 extra bucks on my homeowners so it completely slipped my mind.

If you have coverage for an item valued at $5000 (or whatever amount) and you don't list it on your petition, the trustee will be interested in that. How much were your guns insured for? Do you have a bill of sale? It may not even be an issue, some trustees don't even ask for insurance policies, BUT...you never know.

[blackomega]

4 guns total, Bill of sale for 3, 1 was sold at a gunshow. BTW what district was your ex's BK in? From everything I find it seems that the joint title should fall under TBE since we both share the vehicles, I drive hers sometimes and vice versa, either way thats an attorney question I agree.