when does the 60th day end?

[music12]

hi all,
does anybody know whether the 60th day ends at 5pm or at 11:59pm?

back when things were not electronic, the answer would have been obvious: the end of the day is when court closes. now with pacer, can someone file an AP at 11:58pm and claim they beat the deadline? hope not!!

[2manybills]

Technically, probably because you can file anytime day or night on Pacer now. Now in the State courts here that are actually doing efiling, they do not work that way, once court closes, you go to the next day. But from the training we took on Pacer, it actually posts for the actual date you file.

But I can't think of anyone filing an AP at midnight at the very last day! I can relate, I check Pacer almost everyday!

[music12]

well, i just can't imagine the pain of seeing something filed at 11:59pm if you had thought you were in the clear at 5:01pm.

does anybody out there know for sure?

[2manybills]

Attatched is a link to the ECF site for Pacer in LA Central District Court.

http://www.cacb.uscourts.gov/cacb/courtprocedures.nsf/New%20General%20Orders/4D3E571E44BC00078825721F006928E0/$FILE/GO%2006-03.pdf


Rule 14 deals with this subject. As I said earlier, that was the way were trained through Pacer. So technically, they can file. During the hours the court is closed, in my experience working with the LA Courts, those documents don't show up until the next day.

[music12]

so at least in your district, it's midnight!!

i think it's unfair. since they can record time of day electronically, the 60th day should end on the same time of day as the 341 was scheduled. otherwise, if the 341 was scheduled at 9am they end up with almost 61 days to file something, and that's a violation of the bk code!!! technology shouldn't allow such atrocities!!

ok, atrocity is a strong word...

[2manybills]

I agree with you. Remember I come from the "old school" of being in the legal community (God I hate that phrase!). Having guys race to the courthouse on motorcycles to get stuff filed through the LA traffic, so this electronic thing has changed everything. And at least here, every court is not the same. Federal courts do things differently from the State and every State court has their own way, some are all efiling and service, some are just efiling but snail mail service, some are eservice but regular filing. You could make yourself crazy!

But the odds of someone actually doing that, unless they have a vendetta or something!!!

I noticed the court on the "days in status" for my 60 days is actually counting from the day the TT filed the report of no distribution. I think that should be from the date of the 341. I know the last day for objection is 10/5, so i guess that's what counts.

[music12]

2manybills, thank you SO much for that link. i used it to find the analogous thing for my district, and guess what? in my district it has to be filed by 4:30pm. huh!

the days in status means nothing; mine still says "awaiting 341". yeah, right!

and yes, the only potential problem i have is with someone having a vandetta. wouldn't have had to file bk otherwise...

i guess you must be a paralegal or lawyer or lawyer's secretary if you had to do the pacer training...

[kenshirley]

I would not worry about it too much. 60 days seems to be an ideal or arbitrary number.
In most cases people like us are discovering that depending on the court district that you filed it it can take longer than 60 days for a clear cut and easy case.

[Amy26]

Silly music! It never ends! It goes on and on and on and on....the wheel in the sky keeps on turning...... don't know where I'll be tomorrow....
Sorry... your name is music... so... I started singing....

[music12]

glad to be an inspiration! keep on singing until your 61st day, then check pacer

[Amy26]

I have a little over 30 days left! Woo!

[2manybills]

[QUOTE=i guess you must be a paralegal or lawyer or lawyer's secretary if you had to do the pacer training...[/QUOTE]

Yep, I'm a Office Administrator and paralegal to the Senior Partner. The court rules are crazy. LA Central District is the only district that also requires the attorney to do an online 2 hour training about Pacer and ECF filing.

I don't know if its an advantage working in the legal field or not, I drive myself crazy thinking about worse case scenarios.

[music12]

yeah, it's like being a doctor thinking you have all the diseases out there.

[2manybills]

No kidding! I told my attorney (who is a friend) that I know I"m thinking too much! He said "You're brains just think like a lawyer"! I don't know if that is good or bad!

Good luck! I'm sure it will be fine!

[justbroke]

The biggest thing you want at 60-days after the first scheduled 341 Meeting of Creditors is the Objection to Discharge bar date. As for discharge, they like to do them 60-days after the concluded 341 Meeting (may not be the first scheduled one). However, there is nothing in the Bankruptcy Code that says they need to be done on day 61 or day 62 or day... However, most Districts will grant a discharge after the 60-days has elapsed (after the concluded 341 Meeting).

That's why the big thing is to get to Day 61 past the concluded 341 Meeting. There are no more objections to discharge allowed, as the bar date would have passed. While you may not have the official discharge entered, you should have no fear of any objections after that point. The bar date is set by the Rules... Rule 4007(c).

(Writer's Note: While I say 60-days past the "concluded" 341 Meeting, i say so because the Trustee has dismissal powers within the 60 days after the concluded 341 Meeting. Creditors would only have 60-days from the first "scheduled" 341 Meeting to file a Complaint as to Dischargeability on their specific debt(s).)