tools of the trade? I need my equipment

[icicle22]

I just had my 341 today and it went well except that the trustee has questioned my camera equipment. My attorney had stated that we'd list it but that it would not cause any issues. Now I have to go get it appraised as the trustee wants to verify it's worth.

Now, to clarify, my income is based on my ability to shoot and edit with this equipment. If I recall, there is a ridiculously low exemption on "tools of the trade" so what can I expect? I can't afford not to have it because my income and job will be at risk, yet I may not be able to afford to keep it either. It could be a catch 22. This is supposed to be a fresh start but already I am already in another finacial/employment conundrum right after the meeting!

My attorney had told me that "if" they determine it has value (which I am sure it does) that they may want to take it, but I would have the opportunity to keep it if I paid the trustees for it. Well, that would be a little tough at this point. Has anyone been in this boat?

Also, I am not self employed but I do a lot of sub contracting work through my employer and my camera is required for this.

Thanks for any insight.

[SuzieBK]

Icicle, the new Ohio law is $2,025 for tools of the trade. If your cameras were sold right now on eBay or Craig's List, would they bring more than that? Have you already maxed out your personal property exemption? It's $10,500, so that would cover a lot. Also, if you're filing jointly, a lot of the exemptions are doubled. Good luck!

[DeadManCrawling]

First thing:

Do NOT take this to a camera shop or anyplace that is "professional" in nature.

Ask your attorney, first, but generally speaking you want to take this to the cheapest pawn shops in town. Get a couple people there to write down what they would pay.

Remember, the trustee will NOT be selling this in the pro magazines or at a pro sale, but at the equivalent of a garage sale.

If attorney says it's ok to use this method, which I think is probable, you will be amazed at how little value this stuff has to joe consumer. And that is exactly who the trustee might sell it to, not pro photogs.

Good luck!

[icicle22]

I'm not questioning your answer, but can you point me to anywhere online that I could verify that? I am seeing $750 for tools of the trade on many documents for Ohio on-line but they may be outdated.

thanks.

Icicle, the new Ohio law is $2,025 for tools of the trade. If your cameras were sold right now on eBay or Craig's List, would they bring more than that? Have you already maxed out your personal property exemption? It's $10,500, so that would cover a lot. Also, if you're filing jointly, a lot of the exemptions are doubled. Good luck!

[SuzieBK]

Icicle, I PM'd you on this, but in case others are interested: LegalConsumer.com is the only site I've seen with the exemptions updated: http://tinyurl.com/qvejeg. They make bk a LOT better for Ohioans.

[icicle22]

OK, So I am now nearly seven weeks out since my 341 hearing and I have yet to get my camera equipment appraised. My attorney says that he need to refer me to a place to appraise it, but he hasn't been able to get a response from the auction house that he is dealing with. He has extended the time I have to get it appraised but at this point he is saying we will probably need to take it Dodd camera, which is in fact a high end photo- video store that will likely appraise it way too high.

Does anyone know how I can find out where I can get it appraised that is acceptable to the court? This has been dragging on too long and I need to get this rectified, but the last place I want to take it is a professional video house that will likely high ball the price.

Any help here would be appreciated. My attorney does not seem to have any ideas other than an auction house and the pro camera shop so asking him repeatedly is only going to irritate the situation.

Thanks.

[StartingOver08]

There must be trade publications you can refer to for an independent type appraisal - or a source of recent sales.

As pointed out earlier - if you bring it to the high end shop it will not help you. Can you maybe google for similar equipment to see the pricing on e-bay or craigslist or other databases?

[AngelinaCatHub]

You mentioned "approved" place. The eBay idea would be my choice if accepted. Search on ebay your exact equipment. Go Google "price+camera+model" and many camera blogs can help you.

Now we became as asset case after the fact. So here is how they worked with us; 30 more days with a suggestion of assets sent to Matrix. Petition to sell to the Court, Lawyer requested purchase by us. The Trustee lowered the price and gave us 12 months, no interest even payments to purchase our own assets. We performed this duty and are pleased with their cooperation. 'Hub

[AngelinaCatHub]

http://www.thebankruptcysite.org/exemptions/ohio.html

[AngelinaCatHub]

Bankruptcy Exemptions: Federal and State Exemptions

When you file bankruptcy, you are required to fill out quite a few bankruptcy papers. Among these are Schedule C, which is a form where you list the property you are claiming should be exempt (meaning you get to keep it).

Both federal and state laws provide exemptions for certain property that a debtor is allowed to claim as exempt. What property is eligible for exemption status varies from state-to-state; however, some states allow you to choose whether to use the federal exemptions or your state's exemptions. If federal exemptions allow you to keep more property than your state's exemptions, then you should opt for federal, provided your state allows it (not all states allow you to choose between federal and state exemptions).

The following states DO ALLOW you to use the federal bankruptcy exemptions if you want: Arkansas, Connecticut, Washington, D.C., Hawaii, Massachusetts, Michigan, Minnesota, New Jersey, New Mexico, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, South Carolina, Texas, Vermont, Washington, and Wisconsin.

The following states DO NOT ALLOW you to use the federal bankruptcy exemptions: Alaska, Arizona, California, Colorado, Delaware, Florida, Georgia, Idaho, Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Kansas, Kentucky, Louisiana, Maine, Maryland, Mississippi, Missouri, Montana, Nebraska, Nevada, New Hampshire, New York, North Carolina, North Dakota, Ohio, Oklahoma, Oregon, South Dakota, Tennessee, Utah, Virginia, West Virginia, and Wyoming. If you do not use the federal exemptions (either by choice or requirement), you are also allowed to use the federal non-bankruptcy exemptions.

What property is exempt under federal law?

Remember that only 15 states and Washington, D.C. allow you to use the federal bankruptcy exemptions (see above). These exemptions can be doubled if you are filing bankruptcy jointly with your spouse --

Personal and Real Property:
(1) Household: Up to $425.00 per item not to exceed a total of $8,625.00 (includes animals, appliances, books, crops, furnishings, household goods, clothing, musical instruments)
(2) Jewelry: Up to $1,075.00
(3) Vehicles: Up to $2,575.00
(4) Work tools (implements, books and tools of trade): Up to $1,625.00
(5) Health aides (wheelchair, etc.): Unlimited
(6) Burial plot: Up to $16,500.00 (in lieu of real estate exemption)
(7) Real estate (house, co-op or mobile home): Up to $16,150.00
(8) Any property: Up to $8,075.00 of unused portion of real estate exemption

Wages, Pensions, Recoveries and Benefits:
(1) Wages: None
(2) Wrongful death funds: Amount needed for support
(3) Personal injury funds: Up to $16,500.00 (excluding that for pain and suffering or pecuniary loss)
(4) Lost earnings payments: Unlimited amount
(5) Retirement benefits: Amount needed for support
(6) Alimony / child support: Amount needed for support
(7) Unemployment compensation: Unlimited amount
(8) Veterans benefits: Unlimited amount
(9) Social security benefits: Unlimited amount
(10) Public assistance: Unlimited amount
(11) Crime victims compensation: Unlimited amount

Insurance:
(1) Disability: Unlimited amount
(2) Unemployment benefits: Unlimited amount
(3) Unmatured life insurance: Unlimited amount
(4) Life insurance policy loan value, dividends or interest: Up to $8,625
(5) Life insurance proceeds: Amount needed for support

What property is exempt under state laws?

In general, most states allow you to keep much of your personal property, particularly that which has little or no value. You can even keep collateralized property in certain circumstances (of course, you have to reaffirm the debt).

Personal property includes tools that you use to earn a living (although there are limits on this); your clothing; and all of your household goods. As to your income, usually about 75% of your wages, and all of your unemployment and welfare benefits, worker's compensation, pensions, and insurance benefits are exempt. Most states allow you to double the amount of the exemption if you're married, but not all states, so make sure your state allows this before doing any calculations. [Click here for more information about state exemptions]

http://www.bcsalliance.com/y_bankruptcy2.html

[AngelinaCatHub]

Filing Bankruptcy: Federal Non-Bankruptcy Exemptions

You are allowed to take the federal non-bankruptcy exemptions if you choose (or are required) to take your state's exemptions. In other words, if you take the federal exemptions, you CANNOT use the following exemptions:

Real Estate: None

Personal Property (unlimited amount): Savings account deposits while on permanent military duty outside U.S.; seamen's clothing

Pensions (unlimited amount): Civil service employees; foreign service employees; military honor roll pensions; military service employees; social security; veterans benefits; veterans medal of honor benefits

Benefits (unlimited amount): Government employee death and disability benefits; harbor workers death and disability benefits; judges survivor benefits; judicial center directors survivor benefits; lighthouse workers survivor benefits; longshoremen death and disability benefits; military service survivor benefits; Supreme Court Chief Justice administrators survivor benefits; U.S. court directors survivor benefits; war hazard death or injury compensation

Wages: 75% of earned but unpaid wages (judge has right to allow more for low-income debtors); wages of seamen while on a voyage (unlimited amount)

Insurance (unlimited amount): Railroad workers unemployment insurance

Miscellaneous: Klamath Indian tribe benefits (unlimited amount)

http://www.bcsalliance.com/y_bankruptcy2b.html

[AngelinaCatHub]

Bankruptcy: Non-Dischargeable Debts in Bankruptcy
Filing Bankruptcy
Types of Bankruptcy
What Happens After Filing Bankruptcy
Automatic Stays
Bankruptcy Exemptions
Non-Bankruptcy Exemptions
Who Shouldn't File Bankruptcy
Revisions to the Bankruptcy Code
Sample Bankruptcy Forms
Directory of US Bankruptcy Courts
Directory of Approved Credit Counselors
Do-it-Yourself Bankruptcy Kit

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There are certain debts and obligations that can never be discharged in a Chapter 7 bankruptcy. They are as follows:

All debts that you didn't list on your bankruptcy petition will not be discharged;

Criminal fines and debts -- All court fees and court-ordered judgments related to any criminal activity cannot be discharged -- neither are any judgments or debts incurred as a result of personal injury or death to others caused by your own negligence or criminal activity;

Student Loans that have been in repayment status for at least seven years. Although there is a general policy not to discharge student loan debt; in some very rare circumstances, older student loans can be discharged, particularly if a hardship condition exists;

Taxes -- Federal, state and municipal taxes that became due within the last three years;

Fraudulent debts -- Any debt that the court finds was obtained fraudulently or illegally will not be discharged. For example, if you ran up debt on a credit card shortly before filing bankruptcy (within 60 to 90 days of filing), the court will refuse to discharge that debt. In addition, if you lied on a loan application to obtain funds -- that related debt will not be forgiven in bankruptcy;

Dischargeable debt you incurred to pay off non-dischargeable debt -- For example, you cannot take a cash advance on a credit card to pay off last year's taxes, just so you can write it off in bankruptcy;

Alimony and child support payments (court-ordered) are not dischargeable;
Divorce and property settlements are not dischargeable unless the other party agrees to it.

If you are not a good candidate for Chapter 7 bankruptcy for any of the reasons listed above, you might still be a good candidate for Chapter 13 bankruptcy. To qualify for Chapter 13 bankruptcy, you must have an income that allows you to pay back your debts over a 3-5 year period and your current debts cannot exceed limits set forth in the bankruptcy code.

Priority debt -- you have a significant amount of priority debt (taxes, wages owed to employees and any social security benefits, pensions, etc.) that would not be dischargeable under a Chapter 7 bankruptcy. Priortity debt is dischargeable under Chapter 13;

Valuable property -- you don't want to turn certain property over to the bankruptcy trustee for auction. For example, a diamond ring that is a family heirloom and which exceeds the value of your allowable exemption

Secured debt -- you are behind on your mortgage or car payment, but would like to keep these assets. Chapter 13 bankruptcy allows you to keep this property and catch up on arrearages

Dishonest activity -- you can get out of paying a significant portion of debt incurred from fraud or malicious and criminal activity in a Chapter 13 bankruptcy.

Although Chapter 13 requires debtors to pay back their creditors over a 3-5 year plan, in reality, unsecured creditors are not paid back in full. The average unsecured creditor gets about 60% of what is owed him; and some unsecured creditors, like credit card companies, get just pennies on the dollar. If you fall behind in your payments, you can convert your bankruptcy to a Chapter 7.

http://www.bcsalliance.com/y_bankruptcy3.html

[AngelinaCatHub]

Etcetera: Go to the first link and read the whole article. Very good. 'Hub

[icicle22]

Thanks for all the fast replies! I am personally well aware of the value of the camera as I am a self professed geek when it comes to these things. I can get prices and a quotes all over from Ebay and online forums and such but I am under the impression that I have to take it to a "bankruptcy approved" appraiser. I am not trying to rip off the court and I am aware of the exemptions but my camera's value is either just around the amount of the exemption at a "realistic price" or quite a bit more if I get it appraised at a high end camera shop.

So does anyone have any idea what the court "officially" requires or at least know how I can go about finding this information?

[OhioFiler]

Thanks for all the fast replies! I am personally well aware of the value of the camera as I am a self professed geek when it comes to these things. I can get prices and a quotes all over from Ebay and online forums and such but I am under the impression that I have to take it to a "bankruptcy approved" appraiser. I am not trying to rip off the court and I am aware of the exemptions but my camera's value is either just around the amount of the exemption at a "realistic price" or quite a bit more if I get it appraised at a high end camera shop.

So does anyone have any idea what the court "officially" requires or at least know how I can go about finding this information?

If you use anyone reputable you should be fine. The court doesn't have approved tools of the trade appraisers or approved photographic appraisers.