Hi all,
I just registered to get some feedback on our Ch 7 proceedings.
My wife and I filed for Ch 13 on 30 May 2008. We had income as follows: $78K per year from my job, with additional variable pay annual lump sum bonus of between $15-30K. My wife owns her own home cleaning business and our income from that was about $20K per year, much less after deductions but they don't allow that in the filing process.
We had proposed a payment of $350/month for 5 years to the trustee for the creditors on debt of $130K unsecured and $243K secured. We waited until fall of last year to hear the trustee had rejected that proposal.
In the meantime on June 24th, 2008 I admitted myself to an alcoholism rehab treatment program. I was in there for 7 days and decided to go from there right into another 30 day residential treatment program. This was my 3rd time into a treatment program and I had to make sobriety work.
In the treatment programs I was away on FMLA with short term disability running concurrent with FMLA. My wife and I decided to I should stay in the residential treatment program for a full 90 days and I did so. Short term disability runs 6 months with the first 90 days at full salary and the second 90 at 75% of salary. I also had to give up my car allowance when on short term disability.
Because I stayed the full 90 days in the residential treatment program my company was able to reassign my job (policy states after 90 days they may do so and it was sales). Upon my return to work I would be an employee in an unassigned status, with no pay, and have 90 days to find a position internally or be released (fired).
Due to the economic climate and my company also doing downsizing I decided to stay on disability and fully focus on my recovery. In mid-December 2008 I was approved for long term disability based on my medical caregivers recommendations that I not return to work until I was considered to be in full sustained remission with my alcoholism. My long term policy provides for benefits of 60% of salary (before tax) payments monthly, with no taxes to be paid as the premium was paid with after tax dollars.
I believe I likely have until the end of June 2009 for the long term disability approval to run through (as that will be my 12 months of sustained sobriety). The insurance company has conditionally approved my disability for the 24 months the policy allows for, of course that has to be documented and approved every 4-6 weeks by my healthcare providers...and benefits could be terminated at anytime by the insurance case file manager.
A key question is this: I do not have a job to return to. Once my disability has ended the inactive employee status also ends with the company and I will have no job. How does the court likely view this even though I am on disability?
Given these changes of events in December 2008 my wife and I spoke with our attorney about converting to a Ch 7 from the Ch 13. He did the means test, we passed, and we were just under the state threshold for a family of 4 income-wise.
So in mid January 2009 we converted to Ch 7. We had only just finally heard from our Ch 13 trustee with her denial of our proposed payment amounts in late November 2008!
We had our meeting with the panel trustee in the 341 hearing and she asked for a couple additional documents providing explanations for some money we had spent after our Ch 13 filing. I told her my story about the alcoholism rehab and disability status and she seemed encouraging about it. We provided the evidence she asked for and she was satisfied and later issued her no asset finding.... asking the court to be withdrawn from the case.
But 9 days after the 341 we heard from the US Trustee by mail with a 707 Presumption of Abuse notice. He would either seek dismissal, move us to a 13or request withdrawal of his Presumption in 30 days.
Neither we, nor our lawyer have yet to be asked for any supporting documentation or been contacted in any way by the US Trustee aside from the letter of notification. Because we have converted from 13 to 7 we cannot be recommended to move to a 13 at worst and would need to refile if our case is dismissed completely.... with all attendent costs.
I asked our attorney if there was a problem and how to proceed and he said no we would be fine and to be patient. I asked if he intended to contact the US Trustee and he said no they would wait to learn of the finding by the US Trustee first. If necessary he said there would be a hearing scheduled and he believed we would come out fine if that process were necessary. He completely reassured us that he thought things would work in our favor.
We have until the 15th of April 2009 to hear from the US Trustee regarding his decision for our case in terms of the Presumption of Abuse. Does anyone have any thoughts or insights?
Thanks,
Soonerfan
I just registered to get some feedback on our Ch 7 proceedings.
My wife and I filed for Ch 13 on 30 May 2008. We had income as follows: $78K per year from my job, with additional variable pay annual lump sum bonus of between $15-30K. My wife owns her own home cleaning business and our income from that was about $20K per year, much less after deductions but they don't allow that in the filing process.
We had proposed a payment of $350/month for 5 years to the trustee for the creditors on debt of $130K unsecured and $243K secured. We waited until fall of last year to hear the trustee had rejected that proposal.
In the meantime on June 24th, 2008 I admitted myself to an alcoholism rehab treatment program. I was in there for 7 days and decided to go from there right into another 30 day residential treatment program. This was my 3rd time into a treatment program and I had to make sobriety work.
In the treatment programs I was away on FMLA with short term disability running concurrent with FMLA. My wife and I decided to I should stay in the residential treatment program for a full 90 days and I did so. Short term disability runs 6 months with the first 90 days at full salary and the second 90 at 75% of salary. I also had to give up my car allowance when on short term disability.
Because I stayed the full 90 days in the residential treatment program my company was able to reassign my job (policy states after 90 days they may do so and it was sales). Upon my return to work I would be an employee in an unassigned status, with no pay, and have 90 days to find a position internally or be released (fired).
Due to the economic climate and my company also doing downsizing I decided to stay on disability and fully focus on my recovery. In mid-December 2008 I was approved for long term disability based on my medical caregivers recommendations that I not return to work until I was considered to be in full sustained remission with my alcoholism. My long term policy provides for benefits of 60% of salary (before tax) payments monthly, with no taxes to be paid as the premium was paid with after tax dollars.
I believe I likely have until the end of June 2009 for the long term disability approval to run through (as that will be my 12 months of sustained sobriety). The insurance company has conditionally approved my disability for the 24 months the policy allows for, of course that has to be documented and approved every 4-6 weeks by my healthcare providers...and benefits could be terminated at anytime by the insurance case file manager.
A key question is this: I do not have a job to return to. Once my disability has ended the inactive employee status also ends with the company and I will have no job. How does the court likely view this even though I am on disability?
Given these changes of events in December 2008 my wife and I spoke with our attorney about converting to a Ch 7 from the Ch 13. He did the means test, we passed, and we were just under the state threshold for a family of 4 income-wise.
So in mid January 2009 we converted to Ch 7. We had only just finally heard from our Ch 13 trustee with her denial of our proposed payment amounts in late November 2008!
We had our meeting with the panel trustee in the 341 hearing and she asked for a couple additional documents providing explanations for some money we had spent after our Ch 13 filing. I told her my story about the alcoholism rehab and disability status and she seemed encouraging about it. We provided the evidence she asked for and she was satisfied and later issued her no asset finding.... asking the court to be withdrawn from the case.
But 9 days after the 341 we heard from the US Trustee by mail with a 707 Presumption of Abuse notice. He would either seek dismissal, move us to a 13or request withdrawal of his Presumption in 30 days.
Neither we, nor our lawyer have yet to be asked for any supporting documentation or been contacted in any way by the US Trustee aside from the letter of notification. Because we have converted from 13 to 7 we cannot be recommended to move to a 13 at worst and would need to refile if our case is dismissed completely.... with all attendent costs.
I asked our attorney if there was a problem and how to proceed and he said no we would be fine and to be patient. I asked if he intended to contact the US Trustee and he said no they would wait to learn of the finding by the US Trustee first. If necessary he said there would be a hearing scheduled and he believed we would come out fine if that process were necessary. He completely reassured us that he thought things would work in our favor.
We have until the 15th of April 2009 to hear from the US Trustee regarding his decision for our case in terms of the Presumption of Abuse. Does anyone have any thoughts or insights?
Thanks,
Soonerfan
Now known as- Free Willy
waiting to file in july-august,
Comment