Need a new attorney ASAP...

[liz417]

Hi,

I am so frustrated right now and need to rant...sorry...
I finally paid my attorney in full last month (I wished I would have found this site BEFORE I retained the 1st attorney I consulted with), he told us (our consult was almost a year ago) that we would only qualify for a ch 13...well, after spending lots of hours on this site and almost one year later...I find out that isn't necessarly the case...
Although our income is over the median by 15-20k, our expenses outweigh our income so I told our attorney that I wanted to try and do a ch 7 instead. I've read LOTS of stories of members here that have been discharged while over the median income. Today, my attorney calls and leaves a message with my hubby (I'm basically handling all of the BK stuff) that based on our income WE DO NOT QUALIFY!!! The attorney told my hubby that there are attorney out there that will "fudge" the numbers, do unethical things, etc., to qualify people in a ch 7, but HE WON'T DO ANY OF THAT!! I'm not asking ANY attorney to "fudge numbers", I just want to make the best decison possible, if I try for a ch 7 and the Trustee kicks us to a ch 13, then I've know I've done all I could. I tried to call the attorney back and he's on VACATION!!! I think I am going to go nuts while I wait for his return.

Any suggestions guys? Does he sound like he has our best interests in mind?
PM me if any of you have another attorney recommendation in CA (Riverside/San Bernardino Court).

Thanks...rant over....

[TEW]

Liz
have you tried doing the numbers yourself. I did that just to compare what my lawyer came up with and what I thought it should be.

[DebtStinks]

I wrote a means test wizard that is pretty easy to follow. Just take your time and fill everthing out. If you have any questions ask them here. You have the option at the end to print out a copy of the means test (based on the eastern california form) but the are very similar. If you pass I would then send a copy of it to your lawyer and ask them to point out where you made the mistake in your calculations (odds are they are just to lazy and dont' want to deal with an over the means client). If you paid him in full already this shouldn't be a problem.

Means Test Wizard

[liz417]

Liz
have you tried doing the numbers yourself. I did that just to compare what my lawyer came up with and what I thought it should be.

Do you mean the means test on Legalconsumer.com? Yes, I have and it says that I pass the 2nd part after I enter all my expenses (if I did it right). That's why I'm confused...I should be able to qualify for a ch 7. I've given all the paperwork, expenses, etc. to this attorney, but according to him, we don't. He spoke to my husband and my husband is just taking this Attorney's word for it because...he's the professional...I'm WAS going to ask him if he plugged in our numbers or if he's just going by our income alone?

[DebtStinks]

The means test at Legalconsumer.com sucks IMHO. In fact I hated it enough to write my own!

[liz417]

The means test at Legalconsumer.com sucks IMHO. In fact I hated it enough to write my own!

Yes, it did suck and took me a couple of times to work through it. I will try your test...

[DebtStinks]

[liz417]

On a side note, I spent a ton of time reading these boards and working out my own numbers before I ever spoke with an attorney. I then setup like 10-12 free consultations with pretty much every attorney in my area. It was actually pretty fun to get all the different viewpoints. Although a sad fact was I know more about bankruptcy than about half of the attorneys that I spoke with. It seems that many are just trying to jump on the bankruptcy bandwagon by hiring a paralegal that knows bankruptcy and then just signs off on the forms that their paralegal fills out. I would rather file pro se than deal with a legal firm that is setup this way. I want to deal with an attorney that knows bankruptcy inside and out… not some paralegal that can’t even give me advice without breaking the law.

Exactly how I feel!!
I'm a pretty "tough cookie" when it comes to stressful things, but I think when we finally realized that we needed to file for BK (as a majority of the people here, NEVER in my wildest dreams would I have thought I'd end up in BK), so when we finally faced our bleak future and decided to think about BK, my husband's company gave us the referral...I was a mess in that office, crying, etc., I'm sure this attorney saw us as a "scared couple" and would easily follow his direction. Now, I'm stronger, know what needs to be done and not so intimidated.

[TEW]

Liz try the one on debtstinks

[DebtStinks]

Good glad to hear that you aren't intimidated anymore... knowledge is power!

I could file pro se "probably" without an issue at this point. But why would I want to risk it with such an important decision and if you screw up it's not trivial. I want an attorney that knows the way my local court rules on all the grey areas of the bankruptcy code and is familiar with the local trustees as well. I just want to go in knowing it will be a slam dunk!

[liz417]

Okay...I did DS's Test Wizard (thanks by the way ) and didn't pass the 1st part (obviously), but passed the 2nd part and "abuse" doesn't arise....

I think my attorney is going strictly by our income without doing the test.

[LuciluS]

Liz:

Did you keep a copy of document you gave your Attorney? If you did and I was in your position, I would write him a Certified Letter, Return Receipt Requested, send the documentation Again, and state you Request him to file a Chapter 7 or if you live close drop it off at his office, but make sure someone signs a Form you comprise stating such person received your letter and Documentation.

IMHO, if you went in his office crying and you've spent all this time and know your numbers are Correct and Allowable, demand he file a Chapter 7. He makes more money on a Chapter 13. Probably has a notation on your file 'timid woman' LOL! just being honest.

Do you have receipts (i.e. groceries, CC statements, fuel receipts for your vehicles, bank statements, etc.)? If you are over the Median, the Trustee may request these. There is a poster Jessegirl who is being audited by the UST because she was over and she has been scrambling to get receipts and statements.

Luci

[DebtStinks]

How much was your disposable income?

Many many people are going to qualify for Chapter 7 regardless of their income. Income alone doesn't mean much... people with large secured debt (high secured debt to income ratio) payments are usually going to pass the means test. Now making sure your case isn't going to get thrown out under a totality of circumstance augment is a a different story. But that is usually only an issue if you surrendering the secured property and are way over the mean income with big unsecured debt on top of it all.

[liz417]

Liz:

Did you keep a copy of document you gave your Attorney? If you did and I was in your position, I would write him a Certified Letter, Return Receipt Requested, send the documentation Again, and state you Request him to file a Chapter 7 or if you live close drop it off at his office, but make sure someone signs a Form you comprise stating such person received your letter and Documentation.

IMHO, if you went in his office crying and you've spent all this time and know your numbers are Correct and Allowable, demand he file a Chapter 7. He makes more money on a Chapter 13. Probably has a notation on your file 'timid woman' LOL! just being honest.

Do you have receipts (i.e. groceries, CC statements, fuel receipts for your vehicles, bank statements, etc.)? If you are over the Median, the Trustee may request these. There is a poster Jessegirl who is being audited by the UST because she was over and she has been scrambling to get receipts and statements.

Luci

Thanks Luci and yes, I have all my receipts and documents. I am very organized that way. I am also familiar with jessegirl's case, I just want to make sure that this attorney has my best interests at play. I also am unsure if I even "what to make him file a ch 7", I am seriously considering taking my losses and run!

DS: I don't remember exactly the disposable income (didn't save it), but it was in the negative. I think my high mortgage helps. Thanks!

[LuciluS]

I tend to agree if you can afford to pay another Attorney, it maybe well worth your time and money.

We've already forked over $50 for the Pre Counseling and it is going to expire because my husband found this Forum and Attorney did NOT look at ALL the information I gave him and just said Yep! Chapter 7! Plus, at the the time, I didn't know anything about Bankruptcy.

I was an Accountant before I was disabled due to a car accident in 3/14/05. Just waiting for some income to drop off and all clear from Doc on my Skin Cancer Surgery 2 weeks ago, then we will file using the same Attorney. But you can Betcha! I will be checking,re-checking & re-checking his figures before I sign my name on that dotted line LOL!

Luci