Does my child's income count as income for means test?

[doingpoorly]

This is my first post, so go easy on me.
DH and I are in the planning stages right now and I am trying to figure everything out. We will be to high on the means test if we include January so we are shooting for Feb-July for the means test. Once January is out of the picture everything will be well under, but if we have to include my child's income then things may be a little different. I would hate to tell him to quit. My 17 year old son has a part time job that he uses for his own spending money for things like eating out, movies, gas etc. He is still in high school and is completely dependent on me for everything except the fun stuff. He is a dependent as far as the IRS is concerned. Does his income count as my income for the means test ? I never see one cent. LOL
Also, he bought a computer with some of his earnings. Is that my property and does it need to be included when I list my property?
Thanks so much

[AngelinaCatHub]

Welcome to the "Healing Place". First of all, he has a teenaged job. Does he pay you rent or food money? No. Does he purchase things a kid does? Yes. I would not even mention his kid time small job. Not only would you harm him if you told him to quit, but it is a bad example. Keep this stuff private to kids, and remember he is still under your roof and you suport him, so he is an expense. NO SANE Trustee would object. Just don't mention a thing. 'Hub

[kathy4530050]

Based upon advice from several lawyers I have spoken with, I really doubt you need to worry about this. First, your son is a minor. Second, he is a full-time student. Third, with the $$ he earns he takes care of some of his own expenses, which you won't be including in your own budget (e.g., his computer, entertainment, maybe clothes, etc.) and so you don't need to include his income. Besides, as a minor and FT student, he won't likely be expected to contribute to the family income. I think that where you could run into trouble might be if you were insuring a car for him or making a car payment for him, but I'm not too sure about that.

I have two sons in college (19 and 20) and have been advised that I can include the 19 year old in my household size because he lives with me and goes to a community college, but I can't include my 20 year old because he goes to school out of state. However, I can include my 20 year old in some of budgeted expenses, like groceries and laundry, because he'll live with me this summer. I think you ought to include your son in your expenses without any problems.

Best of luck . . . this will probably be the first of lots and lots of questions you'll have moving forward. I know my questions have never stopped. But you'll find lots of support here.

[doingpoorly]

Thanks for the warm welcome. I have been reading and reading and reading and this forum is a wealth of info. Thanks!

I had considered not mentioning it but here is the potential problem with that. He has a student checking account with me a signer (because he is a minor) and he has deposited his paychecks into that joint account since he was 16. Last month he had his paycheck returned NSF (everyone is doing poorly here in my part of Fl) so he has begun cashing his paycheck at the bank where the company has an account instead of his/my checking account so that deposit will no longer be there, but there are bank account records that show everything till now. He is a super responsible kid who has worked since he was 15 and goes to college while still in high school. I would hate for him to change anything in his life, quitting isn't what I want him to learn. We have done well up till now but because of huge pay cuts now we find ourselves in this situation. At this moment we are current on everything and we will have enough to stay current for the next month or so, but after that we will have used up all of our income tax and savings...bk is inevitable. There is no hope of increasing our income. DH works the same insane amount of hours as before but gets paid less for it now, so a part time job in addition is not possible. He works in construction in Florida and always has. My son knows we are having difficulty, it is hard to hide from him, he knows everything that has gone on so far, just not the bk part of it.
He gets paid about $170 a week so unfortunately that adds up quickly if we have to include it . We are close to the max on the means test. What do you think now about his income? and what about his property, is it my property because he is my dependent and a minor?
smiles

Welcome to the "Healing Place". First of all, he has a teenaged job. Does he pay you rent or food money? No. Does he purchase things a kid does? Yes. I would not even mention his kid time small job. Not only would you harm him if you told him to quit, but it is a bad example. Keep this stuff private to kids, and remember he is still under your roof and you suport him, so he is an expense. NO SANE Trustee would object. Just don't mention a thing. 'Hub

[doingpoorly]

Hi..actually I do have bunches of questions. I hope ya'll can handle it.
My son does have a vehicle (motorcycle) that is registered in my name (because he is a minor) and we have him listed on our insurance. We bought him the bike on CC for $2000. I wonder if we will be able to keep it since it was charged. Anyway it is now worth about $1000 - $1300. We are letting them have our car so his bike will be the only vehicle we will own and hopefully we will be able to use the Fl $1000 vehicle equity exemption on it. He pays the insurance company a portion of the bill each month from his own checking account. I had him do this to learn how to manage things before he leave us.

Based upon advice from several lawyers I have spoken with, I really doubt you need to worry about this. First, your son is a minor. Second, he is a full-time student. Third, with the $$ he earns he takes care of some of his own expenses, which you won't be including in your own budget (e.g., his computer, entertainment, maybe clothes, etc.) and so you don't need to include his income. Besides, as a minor and FT student, he won't likely be expected to contribute to the family income. I think that where you could run into trouble might be if you were insuring a car for him or making a car payment for him, but I'm not too sure about that.

I have two sons in college (19 and 20) and have been advised that I can include the 19 year old in my household size because he lives with me and goes to a community college, but I can't include my 20 year old because he goes to school out of state. However, I can include my 20 year old in some of budgeted expenses, like groceries and laundry, because he'll live with me this summer. I think you ought to include your son in your expenses without any problems.

Best of luck . . . this will probably be the first of lots and lots of questions you'll have moving forward. I know my questions have never stopped. But you'll find lots of support here.

[AngelinaCatHub]

I stay by my opinion as well as Kathy's. Your son in not an issue in this case. It is YOUR bk, not his. He is a minor and the money is his. Because you had to sign on his account as he is a minor, is most explainable as you did. The Judges and Trustees for most part are not ogres, and are not stupid. They understand more than most realize. Your case is explainable. 'Hub

[Flamingo]

To the OP - Your son is part of your household and his income is part of your household income. You also claim him as a dependent and his income offsets anything that you would have to pay for for him if he was not working part-time (i.e., gas, car insurance, etc.). Our attorney at retention asked us if our dependent daughter was working and at the time of filing she was not (freshman in high school). She obtained a part-time job when she was a junior to help out with her car insurance and gas but that was two years after we filed. Discuss this matter with your attorney.

[JRScott]

I'd ask your lawyer on this matter.

It is probably a good idea to have him to continue cashing his check for the near term anyway. However as you suspect you do have to report the bank account and will have to produce records for it. Thus its best to discuss this up front with the lawyer so no surprises later.

[lrprn]

Once January is out of the picture everything will be well under, but if we have to include my child's income then things may be a little different. I would hate to tell him to quit.

First things first - yes, since your son is a member of your household, his income will be added to your initial income totals. However, since he isn't contributing any of his income to the running of the household, his total income will be deducted back out on later Means Test income calculations before your final total income level is set.

Check with experienced bk lawyers in your area to confirm, but this shouldn't be a problem for you and he can keep his job.

As far as the motorcycle goes, as long as the payments are on time when you file and your state's vehicle exemptions cover any equity in full, this shoudn't be a problem for you either.