Ay Caramba! Section F Questions and MORE!

[craigerzz]

Hi everyone, I'm back again for more great advice! Here's some questions that I've come up with...

1) I have several claims on my section F that are duplicate. My question is do they have to be listed right next to each other on the section f printout. form7 puts them in alphabetical order, but the original account and the collection account have different names, even though it's the same debt. Should I put what the original account was in the description if it's a collection company?

2) How far back should I go for my debts. I have some unsecured that I listed from over 15 years ago! These don't show up on my credit report at all but these accounts did exist at one time.

3) Should I list former landlords that I may owe money too. I've never received any notification from him and nothing was notated on my credit report about owing him money. This was a little over a year ago. Should I list him as a precaution???

4) I have several different accounts at some of the same places. I've listed each account seperately and how much I owe. However, on the mailing matrix it lists these same addresses for each account number. How do you handle the schedule f when you have more than 1 account with the same creditor?

5) On expenses, I listed $150 for car insurance because I know that's about what it will cost, however, I don't presently have insurance, but plan on getting it? Whats the rules here, can i keep it on there?

6) And lastly, I have about 20 pages of creditors on schedule F totally about 75K in debt. Is this out of line or about normal here. I don't want the trustee at the 341 to look at me and shake his head saying..."what in the world..." LOL

Thats it for now. The form7 software is quite impressive, although fililng out all this information can be quite brain numbing at times! Any help from you guys is more than appreciated, you are simply awesome with the advice and help you've given me on here!!!!

[originalhealer]

1. List the name of the original account. Then, when you list the collection agency account, list the name of the original account first, then on the second line list the collection agency account, then put "0" for the balance so you don't overstate your actual debt.

2. To be safe, it would be best to list them ALL, even if they are old.

3. Yes.

4. It depends on your state, in mine, the mailing matrix is not required to have account numbers. So, when the courts mail out the notifications of your bankruptcy, they just give your first and last name. It is up to the creditor to determine who you are and which accounts are yours, based on your first name, last name and address.

Which may explain why some creditors don't know you filed, even when you include them. What if you have a really common name, like John Smith, and you moved, and they don't have your current address?

5. Oh, Oh you are in trouble there. If the car is still being financed, they will automatically take it if you don't have proof of insurance. You MUST be able to provide proof of insurance, definitely by the 341 meeting.

6. Unfortunately, mine was worse (including my student loans), and yes, the Trustee did shake his head at me. Oh, well. As long as you are honest, it actually just strengthens your case.

Just take your time with the software, and remember to always back up your data regularly! Good luck

[Genenco]

Regarding #6 it's not hard to imagine (During the dot com boom) that the aftermath of the crash had people making $125,000 a month and having $2,000,000.00 or more in debt and then making $35,000 a year and having the same debt.

Thankfully, most walked away and knew "It's only paper"

[craigerzz]

Hi healer and thanks for your replies, you've shed a lot of light on some stuff I was thoroughly confused about. In regards to car insurance though, I own both of my cars outright, they are not financed so no one will take a repossess them, except maybe the trustee??? The question was more in line with I don't have insurance now, but plan on having it in the future, so should i list it as an expense?

Thanks Again,
Craigerzz

[freshstarter]

The question was more in line with I don't have insurance now, but plan on having it in the future, so should i list it as an expense?

Thanks Again,
Craigerzz

I don't think you can as its not an expense now.

[originalhealer]

I was wondering, did you make sure that both cars are covered under your state's exemptions?

[craigerzz]

Yes, the value of both cars together is under the 5K that the state allows.

[Whittio]

I have read here many times when doing your expenses, to list the amount you WILL spend. For instance, just because you live on $100 of groceries a month now, when you have a little extra income from not paying your cc bills, you would likely spend $400 on groceries. I don't know this for a fact, but in just seems reasonable that you list customary expenses. My mom listed her car insurance and was never asked to show proof of it?? Just my 2 cents, and it's probably only worth 1/2 cent.

[craigerzz]

I thought the same thing, and i plan on getting insurance for both the cars once i find employment. It would seem to make sense to list it as an expense. Fortunately, both cars are owned outright and are not financed and the value of them together fall under the 5K exemption amount. But I do wonder if anyone else has been in this situation and listed the cost of car insurance...

Craigerzz

[StaciMM]

Groceries & bills are not the same type thing... Groceries you may have cut back on due to trying to pay other items. You still bought them though. If you don't have a payment for XYZ (insert bill here) and try to claim it as an expense, is it worth the chance that your entire case could be dismissed or changed to a chapter 13?

The trustee may not ask for it-true. But, if he does and you have to answer that you don't have that expense right now but you will someday... Your choice as to whether or not you want to go there.

I have read here many times when doing your expenses, to list the amount you WILL spend. For instance, just because you live on $100 of groceries a month now, when you have a little extra income from not paying your cc bills, you would likely spend $400 on groceries. I don't know this for a fact, but in just seems reasonable that you list customary expenses. My mom listed her car insurance and was never asked to show proof of it?? Just my 2 cents, and it's probably only worth 1/2 cent.

[craigerzz]

Hi Staci,

Yeah, i decided to omit from my expenses, it's definitely not worth risking my bk over...

Craigerzz

[freshstarter]

The trustee at our 341 did ask some of the debtors if they had auto insurance.

We had no auto insurance or payments to list, but did list monthly vehicle maintenance expenses.

[craigerzz]

thta makes sense to me, thanks, freshstarter

Craigerzz

[TatteredInTexas]

1) I have several claims on my section F that are duplicate. My question is do they have to be listed right next to each other on the section f printout. form7 puts them in alphabetical order, but the original account and the collection account have different names, even though it's the same debt. Should I put what the original account was in the description if it's a collection company?

Okay... I'm confused here. If you are listing the original account (expecting it will be discharged in B/K) what is the need to list the collection agency for the same account? Once the debt is discharged, is it not true that there is nothing left for the collection agency to go after? Or, is this done simply in an effect to notify the collection agency so they will cease calling and sending letters?

All the best,
Ronnie
TatteredInTexas

[StaciMM]

Tattered-any creditors listed on the petition are notified of the BK by the court. The debt is discharged regardless (assuming you list the original creditor). I guess the main benefit is peace of mind for the person filing... The sooner the collection agencies know about the BK, the sooner they stop calling.