Trustee With A Bad Attitude...Feedback Please!!

[6ftladycop]

Well folks,
I am officially a member of the 60 day clubthanks to you guys. My 341 Meeting was today 8-28-07 @1:30pm. I was there early so that I could get some idea of how the process goes. I was glad I did. I can not tell you all the valuable information I got just sitting there listening to all the lawyers and all the different things they were saying. Normally, I would never have known what the heck they were talking about, but thanks to you guys and all the good information I received here...I was ready for just about everything right up until the end of the 341 meeting.

I am still angry, so let me say that first before I get started. I thought I was prepared for all questions that came my way especially since I intended to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but....however, the trustee threw a monkey wrench in my plans when he said something inappropriate...at least that was how I felt and of course I am asking you guys what should be done about it if anything.

1. arrived 45 minutes early
2. had all paperwork ready for him, including some that he may not have had.
3. had my drivers license out and in hand
4. had my social security card out and in hand
5. there was a large group of people and even though I was on time, I did not get called until 1 hour later because of the back up.
6. when my name was called, entered office(no creditors showed up at all).
7. He asked me these questions..a. my name, b. do I have my identification and proof of social security number, c. do I own any property, d. does anybody owe me any money, e. do you owe anybody any large somes of money that they will pay back, f. did you win the lottery, g. do you have insurance policies that are worth money at this time, h. Then he said this to me "do you still have possession of the 2005 CTS Cadillac"?

I told him "yes" and he said, "if you still have the Cadillac, I can not understand why you are filing pro se and could not afford a lawyer..seems to me like you should have been able to".

I told him that the vehicle was leased. When I first leased it 2yrs ago, I had no idea that I would be in the financial situations that I have now. I was in another vehicle at the time and I was up side down by 9000.00 and the lease agreement was to get me out of that car so I would not owe that large amount of money which would have had me in deeper debt than the amounts you see before you".

He shook his head in disapproval, looked at me and said "leased or not, its a very expensive car and I just can not understand not hiring a lawyer, but I have made my decision...I declare your case a NOASSET case and dismissed. Have a nice day and thank you. I told him "thank you" also and left the location.

Listen folks, I have 38,000.00 dollars worth of credit cards, personal loans and medical bills. I know that there were sitting there with me in the court room folks with debt 9x that. For the life of me I could not understand how the meeting turned negative like that. I was advised by a lawyer to just answer truthfully and yes and no answers were more appropriate. I did just that, I was dressed appropriately and everything, so please tell me what went wrong....I am flabergasted The car note is 625.00 dollars a month, but I still have two years on it and I signed the Lease Assumption Agreement, what eles could have been done?

[whatamess]

I really dont know, except that perhaps you were well over your states amount for car payments? I think here its MAX $400. Maybe he thought that was an expensive lease for a chapter 7 no asset to deal with.
Anyhow, its over. You are okay, no asset and thats what matters. Put it behind you and thats about all you can do. No sense beating yourself up for it.
Best wishes, to a happy discharge coming soon!
WAM

[6ftladycop]

I really dont know, except that perhaps you were well over your states amount for car payments? I think here its MAX $400. Maybe he thought that was an expensive lease for a chapter 7 no asset to deal with.
Anyhow, its over. You are okay, no asset and thats what matters. Put it behind you and thats about all you can do. No sense beating yourself up for it.
Best wishes, to a happy discharge coming soon!
WAM

Thank you for your response. I really had no idea that there was an amount to qualify for. In Illinois, once the lawyer did the means test and I qualified(and believe me, I asked about the Cadillac many a times while going in and out of the lawyers office)but I was told that because it was leased and after making the car payments and rent and misc utilities, I was in the negative for 1.00 which could possible change for the positive, it was allowable...and I did pass the means test based on my income. But as you said, water under the bridge. 60 day club here I come and I am hoping for the best in the end.

[JollyGG]

I am deffinately not saying the trustee was right.
I'm just trying to put what he MAY have been thinking into print. That is a high car payment. If you had gotten rid of the vehicle in the bankruptcy and gotten a vehicle with a payment about 1/2 either before or after the bankruptcy then you would have had around $300 each month that you could have saved to pay a lawyer.
Also remember trustee's are often bankruptcy lawyers. So his perspective probably was that filing pro se should only be done as a last resort.
However, great news that he said you were no asset, great news that the 341 is over. Welcome to the 60 day club.

[6ftladycop]

I am deffinately not saying the trustee was right.
I'm just trying to put what he MAY have been thinking into print. That is a high car payment. If you had gotten rid of the vehicle in the bankruptcy and gotten a vehicle with a payment about 1/2 either before or after the bankruptcy then you would have had around $300 each month that you could have saved to pay a lawyer.
Also remember trustee's are often bankruptcy lawyers. So his perspective probably was that filing pro se should only be done as a last resort.
However, great news that he said you were no asset, great news that the 341 is over. Welcome to the 60 day club.

Thanks for the response. I realize that filing pro se was my choice due to my finances at the time. Since filing, I have had a total of 237.00 dollars that did not go to my rent, food, gas and bills. I know for a fact that several people here have said I should have given up the car and under normal circumstances, I would have given up the vehicle but:
1. my only means of transportation for the two children with autism and their different needs.
2. my job is far away from my residence and there is no public transportation to the area.
3. I was told by lawyer that a lease vehicle could be assumed since it was my only means of transportation and since I was never behind in the payments, the dealership was willing to allow the Lease Assumption Acknowledgment.
4. I thought I was pretty sure about the information I received from the different post that said Leased vehicles fall under catagories of items that you intend to keep because of need. I knew I needed a car and the stress it would have placed on our family with those autistic children would have been overwhelming. I asked if this could be done before I started filing a BK and was told that I could assume the lease since I did not own the car. You guys did mention that it was a very high car note, however what I did not see was how to get from under it and still get a reliable car. That was all I ever cared about. I need it for the kids.
5. Had I known that I could have bought another vehicle with a cheaper car note, I would have done so. I was pretty sure that it was stated that you could not assume any more debt until bankruptcy discharded and over. I could not take the chance on what I would use for a vehicle. There was no extra cash to buy one without credit and giving it back would have been a hardship. I was even told that filing bankruptcy on a leased vehicle would at the very least prevent them from allowing me to assume the balance once the agreement was up. I was told that then, I would have to figure out how to get a car when the lease was over.

[southernbelle]

If you don't mind me asking, what is your income? I am considering filing Ch. 7, but my income is over the median.

[6ftladycop]

If you don't mind me asking, what is your income? I am considering filing Ch. 7, but my income is over the median.

36,858.00 for 2005 and 37,428.00 for 2006

[robivi3]

When you say "no asset and dismissed" did he dismiss your BK? Or did he just say that you are no asset and may leave now?

[6ftladycop]

When you say "no asset and dismissed" did he dismiss your BK? Or did he just say that you are no asset and may leave now?

No, I did not misunderstand him at all especially after that crack he made about the vehicle and my hiring a lawyer. He said "well, even though I do not understand how you could not afford to hire a lawyer, I am dismissing your case and declaring that you have NOASSETS.

[freshstart06]

I am confused as well, if he dismiss your case that is not good. You can be declared no asset and still get dismissed. Are you sure he did not mean discharging your case??? I am sorry to ask but how much is your car worth???

My payments on my van is like $380 but we have decided to let it go because it will not pass the emission test. We got approved for on of those BK car loans, our payments went up to $430 only $50 dollars more but we went from having 147k miles to 52K miles and a car in this decade LOL and we did not have to put anything down.

Check pacer in a few days and see if your dismissed or he declared you no assets and want to be relieved of service. i hope that is the case

[guzzie]

hope he meant you are dismissed.....good luck to you....

[6ftladycop]

I am confused as well, if he dismiss your case that is not good. You can be declared no asset and still get dismissed. Are you sure he did not mean discharging your case??? I am sorry to ask but how much is your car worth???

My payments on my van is like $380 but we have decided to let it go because it will not pass the emission test. We got approved for on of those BK car loans, our payments went up to $430 only $50 dollars more but we went from having 147k miles to 52K miles and a car in this decade LOL and we did not have to put anything down.

Check pacer in a few days and see if your dismissed or he declared you no assets and want to be relieved of service. i hope that is the case

Please forgive me for the play on words. He actually said "discharge", but I guess I was so upset I only heard "dismissed". I second guessed myself after reading all the things you guys said and I was unsure, so I checked Pacer and sure enough the document was filed right after I left. It says Discharge. It also says that if I do not complete the second part of that Credit Counseling course 45 days after the first date set for the Creditors meeting, my case will be closed without a discharge , but for now, case discharged as a NOASSET case. Sorry guys. My mistake.

[freshstart06]

Yeah, you had us scared for a moment. Dismissed is not good. I think he just wanted to scare you. Some trustees have this "power" thing going on. So regardless if you had a lawyer or not you still got no assets and discharge coming your way. Thank Goodness, you did not have to spend the money you did not have to get the same results. Welcome to the 60 day club.

[familyof7]

Yeah, Some trustees can be a smart @@@ but I would just look at him as just that and forget about him and say I am going to be through with this burden and stress in 60 days. I am happy for you.

[familyof7]

And alot of trustees as well as lawyers dont particulary like pro se filers and give them a hard time bacause they can I guess. I think they are intemidated by pro se filers because if everyone realized it was possiable to file pro se and that it is not so hard the lawyers would be without a job and most trustees are also lawyers.LOL