Is Filing Pro Se a Rare Thing?

[Lindsay]

From reading the boards and the internet, I had the impression that a large percentage of people file bankruptcy Pro Se instead of using a lawyer. Seeing I do my own taxes and I'm good with paperwork, I was thinking this may be an option to save money.

However, I found the schedule for the 341 meetings from my area and there are about 200 meetings scheduled in the next few weeks. The people are listed under a time slot with their lawyers name. I've noticed that only 2 people are listed as filing Pro Se, all of the rest of them have lawyers representing them. I looked ahead even further in the schedule and only found one more Pro Se filer. There are some lawyers who have 10 different clients respresented on the same day! Also, I notice that the time slots are divided up by hours like 10:30 am, 11:30 am. There are 10 debtors scheduled for each hour, is that how it works and are multiple trustees present?

What happens if you file Pro Se and a problem turns up? Can you hire a lawyer after the fact to help you? I don't anticipate a problem because we didn't transfer any assets or make insider payments or anything shady. We own a home with no equity (actually upside down, I believe), and a vehicle with a small amount of equity. The only thing that worries me is that we did use 2 of the cards recently (no luxury purchases), but for high amounts. We had run totally out of cash and had to charge groceries, all utilities, gas, a home repair item at Home Depot, ect for several months.

Thanks so much for your help; this is such a great board!

[JRScott]

Hi Lindsay.

Yes they schedule multiple people at a single time slot.

Generally the Trustee will do all of one lawyers for that hour then move on to the next lawyer's group etc until everyone is done. It is possible they will run over if there are some rough cases.

There was only 1 Trustee present during the time I was at the 341.

There were many lawyers. There were a few creditor lawyers present too (Only local pay day loan places etc were present).

If you file pro se and then at a later point decide you need a lawyer that is possible. However most lawyers will charge more for fixing it than they would have charged just to have done it in the first place.

Most people do file with lawyers. However there are a number of successful Pro Se filers here. You have to look out for yourself as a Pro Se and keep up on the events. Most people chose that it is better to pay the lawyer to do that and not have as much a burden. Its up to you though and you'll do good if you study hard .

[BKTango]

JrScott is correct on all points, mostly on a lawyer having fits to have to "correct" your mistakes after the fact. It can sometimes be hard to find a lawyer to take you on during an active bk. It's not impossible though. There are many pro se filers out there. Some by choice, and some because they can't afford a lawyer. Each case is different and each person is different. A person can read and look into bankruptcy and then make the decision to file on their own. While others may have to immediately seek bk relief (such as myself) and not have the time or luxury of learning everything beforehand. So we use the money that would have been spent on the creditors to pay for an attorney. It's all comes down to preference and comfortability.

Also those of us with homes and vehicles might need the guidance of a lawyer to ensure proper exempting. Personally we have too many vehicles, a home, and my husbands tools..most for work and a whole lot are not, to many family heirlooms, and other things to protect to take a chance on ourselves doing it. The risk of something going wrong and not knowing how to fix it, was far greater to us than paying for a lawyer. I was using the money to pay the creditors through a debt settlement plan and would have had to continue anyway, so we might as well spend it on a lawyer, that's how we looked at it.

Pro se filers can be successful and not have any situations come up, the same for those that used a lawyer. the opposite is also true those with a lawyer can have problems come up as those that went Pro se. The difference is having the lawyer deal with it all and have the experience and knowledge to do so. Also they are more familiar with your districts laws, the trustees, what will slide and what won't.

If you feel like you can file Pro Se, you can do so, many do and have no problems. If you run into anything and need answers you can always ask here, your local legal aide dept., or your district court can point you in the direction of those that can help you. It's a decision you will have to make and it will be what you feel most comfortable doing. Either way, read...read....and read some more. Make yourself familiar with as much as you can.

[Granny]

Our district had about 8-10 trustee's representatives handling the 341 meeting, most likely they are lawyers who are employed by the trustee.

I live in a large metro area, so there are always lots of people filing in any given month. I'd estimate that there was probably 50 people at the 341 meeting, hence the need for trustee reps.

[resetplz]

I know very little compared to others but i chose to file Pro se simply for the fact i have "nothing", in my specific case with no job no taxes no assets i couldn't see paying a lawyer to do the work for me, but from what i have encountered and read i would say use a lawyer if you have real things that can be lost. But if you do choose to file Pro se then use all the info here and asks as many questions as possible everyone here is very nice and will help if they can, i would also say time permitting go to AS MANY free consults with lawyers as possible and ask different questions at each i.e what can i lose why should i hire you etc etc, hope this helped in some way shape or form and goodluck with your filing and life after BK

[lrprn]

If your case is simple and straightforward - you are well under the median income for your state and family size, you don't have assets to protect, your debt is all personal, you don't have a business involved, you don't have an inheritance or court settlement involved, and you are willing to learn a great deal about bankruptcy on your own, then you will likely do ok with a pro se Ch 7 filing. (Don't even THINK about trying to file Ch 13 on your own!)

If your only goal by filing pro se is to save yourself a little money or you do have some of the more complex situations I mentioned above, then filing on your own is taking a risk that could cost you a lot more than a few thousand dollars in the long run. Only you can decide if the risk is worth it or not.

We do have a fair number of pro se filers in the forum hanging out in the forum right now. Most of them have very simple no-asset cases, did their homework intently ahead of time, and should do just fine.

[HenriettaHen]

The best advice is oft repeated.

Pro Se is not for people in a rush.

DO NOT FILE PRO SE IF THE DOG ATE YOUR HOMEWORK.

[SinkingFast]

I would add to Lrprn and Henrietta's comments,...........

Don't consider Pro Se if you've recently moved and need to use Outa State Exemptions.

We moved about a year prior to filing and had to use Outa State Exemptions. We filed 11 months after the Law changed and less than 500 Ch 7 cases had been filed in our Court.

Add to that irregularities in income in the previous 2 years,......... Severance from job loss, unemployment, and cashing out a Retirement IRA.

Also major swings in our income tax returns. Huge refund one year, owed big time the next year.

Sold a truck to pay the IRS. The Trustee may have been PO'ed loosing out on getting an asset but he sure as heck wouldn't go back to the IRS to get the money.

Sold our house out from under the brink of Foreclosure. Broke even on what we owed plus all costs to sell.

I certainly wouldn't have wanted to sat across from the Trustee at the 341, or had the UST's Office reviewing our paperwork without the seal of approval of a well respected attny.

To us, that was $2K well spent!

[familyof7]

I filed pro se and I was fine but it was very time consuming and stressful we are discharged and closed we do have a house and 2 vehicles but they were exempt. I would have MUCH rather had an attorney but had NO WAY POSSIABLE to come up with the money needed so we filed on our own. I am proud of myself for making it through but if I had the resources of any sort to pay the attorney I would have used one.But it can be done!

[guzzie]

take your time and good luck...guzzie

[cathywhite4495]

I am a pro se filer and have to add to the great comments above. I would suggest buying or borrowing the Nolo book and reading it. You can look at the forms and see exactly what is expected of you. Then you will know if you feel comfortable filing pro se. I had originally talked to a lawyer but it would have taken months and montha to save up the extra money to pay him. I started thinking about going it alone when I got the paperwork from the lawyer and saw how much he was expecting ME to do on the case. I figured if I had to do all the research for replacement costs, pull my credit reports etc etc I might as well do it all

[LilStevens]

If you run into anything and need answers you can always ask here, your local legal aide dept., or your district court can point you in the direction of those that can help you. It's a decision you will have to make and it will be what you feel most comfortable doing. Either way, read...read....and read some more. Make yourself familiar with as much as you can.

Don't count on legal aide dept for much help in some states like mine. Even on my community's courthouse website, I could find no help for those filing Pro Se.