Shady car dealer?

[chicago2471]

I am getting ready to move to an area that I will need to have a car. I am about 16 months into my 13 and finding someone to finance me is a huge pain. I am working with a particular dealer and the finance manager is a bit of a jerk to start but nontheless, they are working with me. I finally get a response back telling me that they were able to work out the financing on the model I want with $1500 down and a $400 payment. I asked him to forward me the information so I can look at the proposed numbers before I agree to have it submitted to my attorney for trustee/judge approval. They won't send it to me saying "it's not the actual contract, it's just the numbers for approval". What? I have not agreed to these numbers yet, I don't know what they even are. Just because i'm a little desperate does not mean I am also stupid.

Am I wrong in feeling this is shady and they should be sending me the information BEFORE ever submitting anything to my attorney?

Thank you for any insight anyone may have.

[chicago2471]

Well a little follow up and I was right, they finally sent me the proposal and it was nearly 4k more than the price I was initially quoted at and even 2-3k more than the prices advertised on their website, not to mention the payment was $451 over 72 months rather than $400. I am just appalled that they were going to send this straight thru to my attorney for submission to the trustee without my even being aware of the terms.

[kornellred]

You know the old adage: you can't have your cake and eat it, too. Chicago has a decent mass transit system - but, unfortunately, it does not go everywhere a person might need to go. You can pretty much forget about reasonable deals when it comes to auto financing in Chapter 13 bankruptcy. It's a big game and you have to pay to play.

[159515951]

Car dealers are going to assume that anyone trying to get a loan while in an active 13 is probably an awful credit risk, so they expect to get rewarded ($$$$) through huge interest rates and full-sticker price sales for taking that risk.

Car loans are a bad idea anyway. Just save up and buy what you can afford, even if that means buying a beater. Somewhere along the line car companies have convinced the American public that a new car every 3-5 years is a must. In reality, a used car every 10 years is more than enough in most cases, and the money you'll save over that same time period will greatly enrich your life.

[max2k10]

Chicago2471 are you replacing a car in your plan or is this new debt that will be added? If new debt I will be curious to see if the trustee will allow that much. I'm currently one 1 year into my 5 year plan and I'm having similar issues. I have 3 leases which I now regret. 2 of them are up in a few months and 1 at the end of next year. I wish my attorney would had told me to convert them to finance instead of lease. Now I have to deal with new I and J's for this new and next year with my other lease. By the way do you mind if ask what percent did they over you? I bet probably high teens. Was this also for new or used car? Sorry for so much questions just that I'm on the same boat as u but in NJ.

[chicago2471]

This will be new debt, I currently do not have any outstanding debt outside of my chap 13. I have been doing just fine within my plan sticking with a very limited budget and living downtown have been able to walk to and from work or take transit wherever I needed to go. I am moving to the far suburbs in a week and will be out of reach of transit to even get me to the metra and will also have a 6 year old in my care at times that I need to be concerned with. Thankfully I have a very good income and my actual living expenses are dropping considerably with this move. I fully realize that I will need to pay a much higher rate than I would prefer the rate quoted was over 16% for a new hyundai once they FINALLY showed me the paperwork they were just going to send off to my attorney for approval without even telling me.

So that is what my true issue is, that I wasn't informed of what they were going to present to the court on my behalf and were not being upfront with me about what the costs were going to be. A 16k car all of a sudden turned into a 20k car and $400 payments turned into $451, what I was verbally told and what was presented were totally different. That's what I am upset about. I wanted to buy a scooter to get me back and forth to the train but was advised since it is so country out where I will be that I'd probably wind up hitting a deer and killing myself, I think that's a little silly but what do I know...

I only ask that they be HONEST with me, I know it's ugly, I am fully aware of the suck that is being in a bankruptcy and that I have to earn back the perfect credit I once had before my divorce and the subsequent credit card companies deciding to jack up my rates to 30% making it impossible for me to keep afloat. But don't treat me like i'm an idiot and try to swindle me. Lay it out in black and white and let me make a decision. If the court decides to deny me, then so be it, I figure something else out but I have the means and the necessity to have a safe car even if it means paying out the rear for a bit until my credit improves.

[chicago2471]

You know the old adage: you can't have your cake and eat it, too. Chicago has a decent mass transit system - but, unfortunately, it does not go everywhere a person might need to go. You can pretty much forget about reasonable deals when it comes to auto financing in Chapter 13 bankruptcy. It's a big game and you have to pay to play.

Not sure anywhere in my post did I imply I was looking for a "reasonable deal" or wanting my cake and eating it too. I am willing to pay for what I have to because of this unfortunately situation that was created that I am responsibly getting myself out of, took two to do it and i'm the only one paying for it at 100% payback because thankfully I do have a good job and I keep my expenses low. Please save the condescending replies, they're not necessary here.

[kornellred]

Hmmmm....I see what you mean. Truisms do not make for relevant replies. It's probably time for me to cease responding altogether. Criticism accepted.

[chicago2471]

You'd do well working as a car salesman or finance manager for this dealer, good at talking and not ever really actually saying anything relevant or useful.

Have a good one. Thanks to those who provided some input and their experiences, it was appreciated.

[max2k10]

Chicago2471, how did you make out with your car situation? The dealer I'm workin with iis still trying to get financing for me so I still have not been giving any numbers yet.

[chicago2471]

I went with a different dealer and what a difference! Patrick dealership here in the Chicago area and I cannot say enough about how wonderful everyone there was. Honest, upfront, told us exactly what to expect, didn't move forward until they had secured a lender on the model I wanted, most were coming in around 23% which was expected because somehow my credit rating which was nearly 800 has dropped to 518 when they pulled this report thanks to all this mess...thank you divorce! Anyway, they got one down to 16.05%, which yes, I realize is still very high but given the circumstances, I am pleased. They explained that I did not qualify for the rebates, etc. and that hyundai doesn't "deal" they put out a low price, well valued vehicle and let it speak for itself. We shopped and there were dealers (such as the first shady one) that jacked the price up, I expect to pay nearly $1500 less than what the original dealer was trying to push thru. Patrick ran everything thru as though I purchased the car and we submitted everything to my attorney, it's set for hearing in two weeks. I signed a paper that says should the trustee not approve the transaction, I return the car, end of deal.

So in the end i'm looking at a brand new 2013 Hyundai Elantra GLS (best safety and gas mileage for the class/price) we have a 6 year old to keep safe and a budget to keep in mind! $441 a month for 72 months (total purchase price at $19k plus tax, tag and title. It was a $28 dollar difference to upgrade to the heated seats (i'm in chicago, work with me here...) bluetooth, etc premium package and since I just dropped a $1500 city rent payment for a $250 burbs payment... I decided why not. The finance manager made sure I clearly knew that I needed to GET OUT OF THAT LOAN as soon as you get the discharge.

Now I wait for the hearing and trustee approval, deliver everything to the finance department and that's that. Keeping my fingers crossed all goes well, the attorney believes with my being in a 100% payoff, my income and my recurring bills (basically nothing - thankfully) it's a no brainer for approval.

I have been very blessed to get this second chance in my life between a fresh start with my financial well being and a fresh start in my personal life. No way will I take that for granted and not appreciate every bit of it. Lucky woman.

Good luck to you!

[toojerm]

Since you are in a 100%, any additional income throughout the year is yours (tax returns, bonuses, overtime, etc.) Just throw everything at this car until its done, then you won't pay nearly as much in overall interest. I had to buy a car in my wife's name (she didn't file, but her credit was poor), but I made sure the dealer understood who was doing the negotiation. The interest sucked, but we payed it off in less than a year, and boosted her credit. Good job leaving that dealer, never spend time with a dealer that wants to negotiate payment over price paid for the car. Best of luck in the plan, and congrats on the move.

[chicago2471]

I'll tell you, I am awesome at handling so many situations but for some reason when it comes to negotiations I am awful. Had it not been for my SO being there and helping I would not have had the backbone to make sure all questions were asked and answered, he certainly kept me strong although he thought we had more wiggle room than we did. Once they explained everything we felt very confident given the circumstances that the best decision was made.

As for throwing everything into it, that's something I was trying to determine what was better, throw everything extra into that or throw it into the bk to try and pay that off faster and refinance. Suppose I need to run the numbers but I would presume it's a better to throw it into the car.

Thanks for the good wishes. I've been ready for this fresh start for some time.

[max2k10]

Thanks again for the update and sharing your experience with us. I'm still waiting on the dealer to call me back with the finance results. A process which seems to be taking forever and one I'm definitely not used to. In my years of purchasing vehicles (21 so far) it was a matter of a few hours. Most times I did all negotiations over the phone and all I had to do was go and sign papers. Not easy anymore with this bl when credit goes from and almost 800 to now 550. Good luck with your plan.