Chapter 13 Divorce

[cz3ch]

I originally filed a Chapter 7 which is now converting to a 13 due to a change in expenses/finances. When I originally filed my wife and I filed for divorce (have the case # and petition already). My lawyer submitted my expenses originally since my soon to be ex-wife and I are living as roommates temporarily until I can find a place to live. My question is, should the lawyer list her income and the household expenses since our divorce isn't finalized and I'm living as a roommate under the same roof? Or can I list my own expenses and income? She said generally living together as roommates with separate expenses isn't a problem but the trustee will question the status of our marriage.

I meet with the lawyer next week to sort all of this out and plugin my new expenses/numbers into the Chapter 13 petition. I just want to know what I'm up against. My expenses and income alone generate a higher payment to the trustee than compared with a combined income/expense with me and my ex-wife.

Thanks in advance.

[indy4wins]

Hi cz3dch:

My ex-wife and I filed for BK 13 in 2007; We separated in March, 2009; Our monthly payment was $1700.00; Once we got separated and could prove there were 2 households, the payment went to $900 a month; It took about 10 months to get this changed and it cost me extra money with my attorney to get the amendment done; Do yourself a favor and try to get this taken care of now so you don't have to re-do it later on down the line; Your only drawback right now is that you can't show 2 households because you are still living together at the same address; If you can prove 2 different sets of monthly expenses, you might be able to get it to work for you; Thanks and have a nice day;

[cz3ch]

Hi cz3dch:

My ex-wife and I filed for BK 13 in 2007; We separated in March, 2009; Our monthly payment was $1700.00; Once we got separated and could prove there were 2 households, the payment went to $900 a month; It took about 10 months to get this changed and it cost me extra money with my attorney to get the amendment done; Do yourself a favor and try to get this taken care of now so you don't have to re-do it later on down the line; Your only drawback right now is that you can't show 2 households because you are still living together at the same address; If you can prove 2 different sets of monthly expenses, you might be able to get it to work for you; Thanks and have a nice day;

I can demonstrate 2 different sets of monthly expenses which is what I had included in my original filing. The new conversion to Chapter 13 I'll have to redo all my numbers and discuss with the lawyer whether or not I have to include her income/expenses with the filing. More than anything I'm just scared of making changes (even though truthful) will be scrutinized and I'll be found fraudulent or something. From what my lawyer has told me I'll be fine, but I'm still scared.

[justbroke]

Your case is getting more and more complex as the onion layers are peeled back. If you do not have a final decree or an actual order of separation, then you are married. If she is actually your spouse and lives in the same "household", then her income goes in Column B of Form B22A/B22C (Means Test). You can offset her expenses using the marital adjustment.

Sounds like you and your attorney REALLY REALLY need to talk!

[cz3ch]

Your case is getting more and more complex as the onion layers are peeled back. If you do not have a final decree or an actual order of separation, then you are married. If she is actually your spouse and lives in the same "household", then her income goes in Column B of Form B22A/B22C (Means Test). You can offset her expenses using the marital adjustment.

Sounds like you and your attorney REALLY REALLY need to talk!

I agree, we are set to talk next Wednesday. I had originally told her everything but she listed me as pending divorce but put only my expenses and income since we're living as roommates. Yes this case is a bit more complex than I had originally thought which is driving me nuts.

[justbroke]

I'm not an attorney, so this is only my opinion. There are people who file bankruptcy separately from a spouse when they are indeed separated and living in separate households. That itself creates a problem, with expenses, but this does happen often. The fact that you two are still married and living in the same household seems complex to me. However, your attorney may be using a "looking forward" approach and hopefully the Trustee agrees with the approach.

[cz3ch]

I'm not an attorney, so this is only my opinion. There are people who file bankruptcy separately from a spouse when they are indeed separated and living in separate households. That itself creates a problem, with expenses, but this does happen often. The fact that you two are still married and living in the same household seems complex to me. However, your attorney may be using a "looking forward" approach and hopefully the Trustee agrees with the approach.

Yes she mentioned the look-forward approach with me which is why she filed the way she did. I'm in the process of finding a place to live but with my credit it's hard to get an apartment. I'm amicable with my soon to be ex-wife which is why we agreed to live as roommates until I can move out.

[cz3ch]

I'm not an attorney, so this is only my opinion. There are people who file bankruptcy separately from a spouse when they are indeed separated and living in separate households. That itself creates a problem, with expenses, but this does happen often. The fact that you two are still married and living in the same household seems complex to me. However, your attorney may be using a "looking forward" approach and hopefully the Trustee agrees with the approach.

Based off of this since we're technically still married and living under the same roof I'm going to ask the lawyer to file the Chapter 13 with her income/etc included. I'd rather play it safe and follow the rules (of which I was a bit misled I feel as the lawyer said I could file while living as roommates as long as my divorce was pending) and get it done right. Luckily converting from a 7 to a 13 will allow me the opportunity to redo the means test and adjust the numbers respectively.

[justbroke]

It just depends on what is acceptable and your attorney might be able to argue that they took a looking forward approach rather than needing to later, post the finalization of the dissolution, modify a confirmed order. Your attorney could be taking the right approach for your specific district and the specific set of circumstances.

If I were in your position, I'd just have the attorney explain why they did it that way. Doesn't mean you need to change it... you're just trying to understand it.