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Likelihood of AP challenge in Ch.13?

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    Likelihood of AP challenge in Ch.13?

    Here's my situation. I have accumulated approximately $60,000 in credit card debt and have student loans that will begin to become due in August. I can't meet all the payments, so I have talked with some attorneys and decided that Chapter 13 is the way to go. (I own a home and earn too much to qualify for Chapter 7).

    I'm an inveterate worrier and I'm now running through every conceivable "what if" scenario. I honestly did not plan on bankruptcy. I was living in a fog of denial up until about two weeks ago. As such, I have been using two of my four credit cards. In recent months, many of the charges have been for nonluxury items - groceries, gas, doctor's office, utilities. However, to be honest, many charges are not essential.

    I have Bank of America with about $1,837 in nonessential charges in the last three months, and a card from Chase with about $2,628 in nonessentials. If I wait to file until about August 14, I can get the Chase nonessentials down to the $500 limit. I'd have to wait a month or longer to do the same with BoA.

    I am currently paid up-to-date on all cards and have been making regular payments throughout my downward spiral.

    Questions:
    1. How likely are AP filings? I understand that any luxury charges over $500 in the past 90 days can be challenged, but I have also heard that it is expensive for creditors to do that, to the tune of about $4,000.

    2. If an AP is filed, what is the likely outcome? From what I read here, settlements are the most common result. Say I agree to pay half. How is that handled? Where does that half come from when you are on a strict Chapter 13 budget?

    3. Here is the part that is the most painful to admit. Some of those charges are related to online gaming. I'm incredibly ashamed of it. Are gambling debts handled differently than, say, debts incurred be overshopping? I feel so guilty about it that there's a part of me that feels I deserve punishment for it. I will be calling my Employee Assistance Plan tomorrow to initiate counseling for gambling addiction, regardless of what else happens.

    What advice can you offer? Thank you!

    #2
    Do a search on this forum as to gambling and filing BK. Gambling debts can single one out for more scrutiny as to their filing so you will have to be upfront and forthright with your attorney about your situation and the reason for the debts. Your looking into counseling is a big plus but now that reality has hit and you are going to file, make sure you continue with that counseling as your situation clears up because realize you have an addiction and if you don't get the help you need to control it, you will be back on here posting several years from now back in the same place. Best of luck to you..
    _________________________________________
    Filed 5 Year Chapter 13: April 2002
    Early Buy-Out: April 2006
    Discharge: August 2006

    "A credit card is a snake in your pocket"

    Comment


      #3
      If you are planning to file ch. 13, its less likely to be an issue from what I understand. Have you started to assess what your plan payment will be, and what - if any - priority debts you will have?

      Worst case scenario, I believe, is that these questionable charges will need to be paid back in full during your plan. More than likely though, nothing will come of it and they'll just get whatever % all of your general unsecured receive.
      Get mortgage modified: DONE! 7 months of back interest payments amortized, payment reduced over $200/mo
      (In the 'planning' stage, to file ch. 13 if/when we have to.)

      Comment


        #4
        I had all those issues including cash advances, etc. with a total of 240K in unsecureds and had 0 objections and no AP's related to charges.
        19% dividend

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          #5
          Agreed, I blew over $250k gambling, I'm in a chapter 13 now, not a peep from anyone (Except the IRS who is looking for their "income" tax on the slot "winnings". Yeah right. So the paper chase goes back and forth with them, amended returns, taking out every penny of gains as a loss on sched A, but that hurts certain other things, so they have a couple $k priority claim). I'm actually happy to have the IRS claim since I figure (a) any money that goes to them instead of unsecureds is a good thing and (b) keeps the unsecureds discouraged about their being much of a recovery pot for them.
          filed chapter 13..confirmed...converted to chapter 7...DISCHARGED!

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by lorelei View Post
            I have Bank of America with about $1,837 in nonessential charges in the last three months, and a card from Chase with about $2,628 in nonessentials. If I wait to file until about August 14, I can get the Chase nonessentials down to the $500 limit. I'd have to wait a month or longer to do the same with BoA.
            Others may chime in on this part, but I don't see why you would pay those down. I would make the minimum payments, put 90+ days between those debts and when you file, and you should have less of an issue. IF you wait and IF an AP gets filed and IF you lose the AP (lots of IFs) then you would simply end up where you are now - paying those non-essential charges in full, but through your plan.

            It sounds like the student loan coming due is what is driving your timing... have you exhausted all of your hardship forbearances? If you are out of forbearance options on your student loans, if you paid the minimums on your CCs for a couple months (to put some time between you and those non-essential charges) would you have enough in your budget to pay the student loans?


            Originally posted by lorelei View Post
            Are gambling debts handled differently than, say, debts incurred be overshopping? I feel so guilty about it that there's a part of me that feels I deserve punishment for it. I will be calling my Employee Assistance Plan tomorrow to initiate counseling for gambling addiction, regardless of what else happens.
            Don't beat yourself up too badly. Flamingo makes some good points about the extra scrutiny and counseling. One of the reasons gambling debts sometimes get a closer review is that they are largly cash transactions that have a greater opportunity for someone to be hiding assets. If you go on a shopping spree, while possible for you to turn $4k worth of merchandise into cash, it is more difficult than just getting a $4k cash advance.

            I had some cash advances as well as a casino marker for considerably more than $4k. No APs from the credit cards - they all filed as unsecured. And being such a "good" customer at the casino, they agreed not to pursue the marker debt.

            The counseling is a good thing to do. That question came up several times, as well as "are you still gambling?" I am not really into the online stuff, so for me, just staying out of a casino prevents me from gambling. However, taking that step (whether individual counseling or your local GA) truly makes you realize the gravity of the situation. Since it was only a few times a year thing (although with some considerable sums being wagered those few times a year) I have used our BK to get that fresh start.

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              #7
              I've made an appointment to meet with a counselor Friday morning. Just knowing that I'll be going there makes me feel so much better. Owning up to my behavior after so much denial has been so incredibly hard to do. But now that I'm taking steps to do something about it, I feel like I'm in control again - to a degree.

              Still worrying like nobody's business about every single angle of the bankruptcy, though. That hasn't gone away.

              One foot in front of the other, right?

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                #8
                Plan, plan, plan some more.
                Or as carpenters say, measure twice, cut once.
                filed chapter 13..confirmed...converted to chapter 7...DISCHARGED!

                Comment


                  #9
                  or amature carpenters say measure twice...cut twice and get a new peice of wood....(hench the Home depot debt LOL)

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