Chapter 13 Questions

[rdmccaffrey]

Hi,
I've been reading the forum for a few months now and have decided to post. I've been searching for answers to a few questions but I dont guess I've found it spelled out easy enough for me to be sure I understand. Thanks in advance for the help!

1. Our case (my wife and I) chapter 13 was filed at the end of February. I have a Boat financed through GEMB and a Yamaha Rhino (ATV) through the Yamaha Factory Financing credit card which is HSBC. Because of the fact these are luxury items and would have greatly affected my payment, I chose to surrender them. The notes on both were current prior to my atty telling me to no longer pay them. How long before I can expect for these to be taken back by the creditors? Is there a chance the creditors may not fool with wanting them back?

2. Our meeting of creditors was yesterday, however before we could be seen the courthouse had to be closed to due power issues. That meeting will be rescheduled is all I know at this point. Is that the last step in this whole ordeal? Do I have to do anything else other than mail the trustee a check until my employer begins to do so? When people say discharged, am I discharged soon? or is this after my 5 years of payments.

3. As far as I know of right now, I'm scheduled to pay 831.50 semimonthly for 5 years. I really couldn't tell the atty who I owed and what. They went by the credit reports and listed everything on the credit report as being owed. My home mortgage is included in the chapter 13. IF I have creditors that don't file claim to get their share of the money, is it possible that I will be out of this in less than 5 years? How will I know this? I think I'm set to pay back 25 percent to unsecured. If less file claim, would that percentage change? how does that work?

Again, thanks in advance. I think thats all my questions for now.

[tigergem]

Wow, sorry, but I think I would try really hard to get more info about owed debts than what was on my credit report. Are you sure no creditors got left out of the schedules?

[rdmccaffrey]

Yes, I feel confident everything was listed. Actually I think too much was listed.

I'm not proud of it, but I had not been paying credit cards for about 2 years. Didn't have the money to pay them, and I just ignored the debt. That gave a lot of time for everything to pile up on the 3 credit reports. Most of my credit card debt has been charged off and bought by these debt collectors who I view as scum. They purchased the debt and then were beginning to file suits for wage garnishment. That is what finally pushed me the point of goign to get an atty. My plan was always in the back of my mind that when things got better I would pay off my creditors somehow. Once purchased by all these scum companies, I figured there was no other way out.

But to answer the initial question, yes I felt like everything I owed was well covered in the credit reports.

[lrprn]

How long before I can expect for these to be taken back by the creditors? Is there a chance the creditors may not fool with wanting them back?

There's no way to know when - or even if - your items will be repossessed. If the creditors don't think they are worth what it will cost to come get them and sell them, it's possible you could end up with the boat and/or the ATV once your Ch 13 is over. Ask your lawyer what he/she has seen happen in these circumstances with other Ch 13 cases in your local court.

Is that the last step in this whole ordeal? Do I have to do anything else other than mail the trustee a check until my employer begins to do so? When people say discharged, am I discharged soon? or is this after my 5 years of payments.

Your 341 meeting is the last meeting you will have to attend. Your confirmation hearing comes along later, but typically only your lawyer attends that.

"Discharged" means your Ch 13 plan is successfully finished. This doesn't happen until all your Ch 13 payments are made, your trustee audits your case, and the court sends you the official discharge notice. Discharge happens after your 5 years of payments.

Your single duty now is to continue making your payments on time every month without fail until you confirm that your employer's payments have kicked in.

IF I have creditors that don't file claim to get their share of the money, is it possible that I will be out of this in less than 5 years? How will I know this? I think I'm set to pay back 25 percent to unsecured. If less file claim, would that percentage change? how does that work?

It doesn't matter if some of your creditors don't file claims - your confirmed payment remains the same.

Even if some creditors don't file claims, it just means that the creditors that do file claims will get a higher % of what they are owed. It won't shorten your number of months unless you can pay back 100% to all of the unsecured creditors who file claims before the number of payments set in your plan are up. With such a low payback %, that's very unlikely.

[rdmccaffrey]

Hey!!! Thank you so much for the quick answers!!! I really appreciate it!

[tgrazor]

Hi Everyone,

I'm in the same boat and have some questions. We live in CT and just filled for BK 13. We only have about 35K in CC debt but had to foreclose on a house that we owned in AZ back in September and may possibly owe 100K from that. We tried everything to keep / sell the house. Bank was a jerk!

Our payback is coming in around $1350 per month. I am scared to death because my husband has a job where he can get bonus but does not always get them and this payback includes some of the bonus that he got in the last 6 months. What will we do if he does not get bonus? On the flip side, What will we do if he earns a lot of bonus? It is not guaranteed income, sad that they can include that. I am a stay at home mom and considered going back to work but that means that they will just take more money from us, so there is no benefit to my family there...

Here are a few questions that I have, if anyone has the desire and time to answer them, I would be very grateful!

What do you do if your income is less than your qualifying income?

What will they do if you get a raise or a large bonus? Do I have to call them and tell them?

Anyone out there doing BK 13 in Connecticut? I'd love to hear your experience!

What if my husband's company tells us that we have to move to another state? It happens every few years.

Can I move into a cheaper house or will the money I save have to also go to the trustee?

Does the trustee check your tax returns every year?

How often do you guys hear from your trustee?

What is a cram down?

Thanks so much for all of your help and time with this matter! I really appreciated it!

Have a great day!
Kim

[tigergem]

Here's what happened with mine. YMMV.

My confirmation order specifically states that I have to give my trustee a copy of my income tax return within 10 days of filing every year. Whether he checks it or not, I don't know. But he will have it.

If I get an income tax refund, which I promise you is not going to happen, my trustee wants it.

If I become employed, I am required within 30 days to submit new budget and expense schedules.

He didn't specify, interestingly enough, that if I win the lottery or have any other sort of windfall, that I have to notify him or give it to him. Only specifically if I become employed or receive an income tax refund. Go figure. Maybe he forgot. lol. I didn't.

I know that you can live anywhere you want to, but you have to keep your BK court and Trustee updated of your new address and phone number. If you move to a cheaper place, I don't know if your trustee will make you modify your schedules or not, but you know, that isn't the sort of thing I want to bring up in conversation with my Trustee.

Basically, you will have to follow the order. What he says to tell him, tell him. What he doesn't ask about, don't talk about. That's my general rule of thumb.

A cram down is where you pay a secured debt at it's current appraised value, instead of the actual loan amount. Usually that means a vehicle. It only applies on vehicles financed over 910 days prior to filing. And that goes hand in hand with the Till rate, which in my case is prime plus 3% instead of the crazy interest rate your lender is charging you. I am paying a little over $9k back at 3.25% on what was a $50k loan at... I forget what it was... some crazy double digit interest rate on the note.

[tgrazor]

Crazy Trustees

Here's what happened with mine. YMMV.

My confirmation order specifically states that I have to give my trustee a copy of my income tax return within 10 days of filing every year. Whether he checks it or not, I don't know. But he will have it.

If I get an income tax refund, which I promise you is not going to happen, my trustee wants it.

If I become employed, I am required within 30 days to submit new budget and expense schedules.

He didn't specify, interestingly enough, that if I win the lottery or have any other sort of windfall, that I have to notify him or give it to him. Only specifically if I become employed or receive an income tax refund. Go figure. Maybe he forgot. lol. I didn't.

I know that you can live anywhere you want to, but you have to keep your BK court and Trustee updated of your new address and phone number. If you move to a cheaper place, I don't know if your trustee will make you modify your schedules or not, but you know, that isn't the sort of thing I want to bring up in conversation with my Trustee.

Basically, you will have to follow the order. What he says to tell him, tell him. What he doesn't ask about, don't talk about. That's my general rule of thumb.

A cram down is where you pay a secured debt at it's current appraised value, instead of the actual loan amount. Usually that means a vehicle. It only applies on vehicles financed over 910 days prior to filing. And that goes hand in hand with the Till rate, which in my case is prime plus 3% instead of the crazy interest rate your lender is charging you. I am paying a little over $9k back at 3.25% on what was a $50k loan at... I forget what it was... some crazy double digit interest rate on the note.

Must be nice to just tell people what to do. If I were a trustee, I would have trouble sleeping at night. How can you take so much away from people? I guess I will just have to wait and see what the trustee wants to see. I like your rule tho... Don't ask, don't tell! I hope I get a nice trustee on a good day, because from what I hear that can make a real difference.

Kim

[sheilaE]

When the time comes, I'm hoping we meet with ours on a Friday. Everyone is happy on Fridays right?

[tgrazor]

When the time comes, I'm hoping we meet with ours on a Friday. Everyone is happy on Fridays right?

I hope the Happy Fairy visits your trustee!

[sheilaE]

lol

[LadyInTheRed]

Must be nice to just tell people what to do. If I were a trustee, I would have trouble sleeping at night. How can you take so much away from people?

Trustees are not taking anything away from people. In exchange for a discharge of your debt, you agree to pay ALL of your disposible income to the trustee during your 36-60 month plan. This is the bargain you make when you file a Chapter 13. The trustee's job is to work on behalf of the creditors to make sure you are keeping your end of the bargain. You have a choice whether to live with your debt or live under the financial supervision of a trustee for a while. I don't think a trustee doing his job in a reasonable and professional manner has any reason to lose sleep. It is reasonable for a trustee to want to know if an unemployed debtor becomes employed or to expect a tax refund go to pay creditors.

While doing thier jobs, all trustees should definitely be nice! There is just no reason not to be.

[tgrazor]

Trustees are not taking anything away from people. In exchange for a discharge of your debt, you agree to pay ALL of your disposible income to the trustee during your 36-60 month plan. This is the bargain you make when you file a Chapter 13. The trustee's job is to work on behalf of the creditors to make sure you are keeping your end of the bargain. You have a choice whether to live with your debt or live under the financial supervision of a trustee for a while. I don't think a trustee doing his job in a reasonable and professional manner has any reason to lose sleep. It is reasonable for a trustee to want to know if an unemployed debtor becomes employed or to expect a tax refund go to pay creditors.

While doing thier jobs, all trustees should definitely be nice! There is just no reason not to be.

I'm sorry if you took offense to my post but as of right now my Atty thinks that the monthly amount we are going to have to pay back is A LOT. I also have a child with special needs so we have unexpected expenses that can't be put into our budget. So we need to figure out how to pay those extra expenses with the pennies we will have left over at the end of the month. I don't know any parent who would be happy about that. Also, some trustees are more compassionate than others. Some trustees are nice to work with and others could really care less about you. Ask some Atty's and they will tell you that it really depends on who you are working with.

Not everyone is empathetic but I am and (as I stated) "If I were a trustee I would have trouble sleeping" knowing that people are out there struggling and trying to do the right thing. I was not slamming anyone only stating how "I" would feel. BTW, we are going to end up being a 100% pay back when my husband starts getting his yearly bonuses, so the companies will getting all of their money paid back to them. No discount for us.

Please don't take everything I say so seriously because sometime people just need to get things off of their chest. Beginning a bankruptcy is a very lonely experience and it is nice to have a place to express how you are feeling about it.

Have a great night!

[sheilaE]

I agree. This forum is a great support system to me and also a place to vent. I know everyone will understand----as we are all in the same boat. I mean no hard feeling to the trustees. I wish I were a trustee. I could totally relate-I'm sure I'd have to be firm, but I'd also be compassionate.

[LadyInTheRed]

I'm sorry if you took offense to my post but as of right now my Atty thinks that the monthly amount we are going to have to pay back is A LOT. I also have a child with special needs so we have unexpected expenses that can't be put into our budget. So we need to figure out how to pay those extra expenses with the pennies we will have left over at the end of the month. I don't know any parent who would be happy about that. Also, some trustees are more compassionate than others. Some trustees are nice to work with and others could really care less about you. Ask some Atty's and they will tell you that it really depends on who you are working with.

Not everyone is empathetic but I am and (as I stated) "If I were a trustee I would have trouble sleeping" knowing that people are out there struggling and trying to do the right thing. I was not slamming anyone only stating how "I" would feel. BTW, we are going to end up being a 100% pay back when my husband starts getting his yearly bonuses, so the companies will getting all of their money paid back to them. No discount for us.

Please don't take everything I say so seriously because sometime people just need to get things off of their chest. Beginning a bankruptcy is a very lonely experience and it is nice to have a place to express how you are feeling about it.

Have a great night!

tgrazor, I wasn't offended and didn't mean to be insensitive. Filing for BK is hard for all of us, regardless of what got us here and what our situation is. We will all get through it more easily if we look at it as taking control of our financial lives instead of thinking of others as trying to take things away from us. Before filing, we are in a position for creditors to continue to take from us in penalties and increasing interest rates and by suing us, getting judgments and garnishing our wages. When we file, we take control by presenting a plan on how we can best pay creditors over the next five years, whether that means paying 1% or 100% of unsecured debt. If a trustee has unreasonable expectations, we need to remember that we are in the drivers seat and need to insist our attorney work for us to get the best deal we can.

I believe that attitude has a big impact on our success or failure. If you start with the assumption someone is taking something from you, you are starting from a position of weakness. Vent and blow off as much steam as you need. But, to get through a Chap 13, you must always remember that you are the only one in control of your financial future!