what do you think

[Limitman]

My plan is set to be confirmed on Dec 15 with one trustee objection but that has been resolved. I have a boat that is going back to creditor keeping house and truck and all other assets which doesn't equal much just some household stuff. My question is I listed an outboard motor in my assets that I do own out right at a value of $6500, do you think I would be able to sell this after confirmation hearing? Since the boat is going back to the bank I have removed the engine and it's just sitting in my garage. I talk with my attorney and they said to just hold on to it for the 5 years then sell after ch 13 is over. The problem with holding on to it is if it's just sitting around it's gonna lose alot of value over time and be worth nothing in a few years, I could probably sell for $5000 now. Work has been really slow and I have been barley hanging on with making the trustee payments but I am doing my best. I don't want to fraud the system or have my case dismissed because I sold something I shouldn't have. The paper work from trustee just says to contact court if I want to sell my house or borrow money, it says nothing about selling anything else. Thanks

[debtinohio]

If you properly listed it as an asset then sell it after confirmation.

[Limitman]

Yes it is listed properly on my paper work.

[debtinohio]

I have no idea why you were told to wait to sell it then, you have already accounted for it's value whether you sell it for cash or keep it as-is. If the trustee wanted the cash they would have made you surrender it.

[Limitman]

That's what I thought as well. I'm paying back way more than the value of the engine anyway and I thought I could sell it rather than having it sit around and rust. Thanks

[lrprn]

Hang on.....not so fast. You listed the motor as an asset along with your boat when you filed, so your trustee as the 'owner' of your financial affairs for 5 years technically controls the motor as well. The bk law for Ch 13s is quite specific that if you want to sell a declared asset after you file and before your plan is successfully discharged, you need your trustee's permission to do so.

Also selling the asset converts a possibly protected physical asset to cash. Trustees really like cash, especially $5K of cash. That would provide a lot of extra money for your trustee and your creditors.

This is why your lawyer recommended waiting until your 13 is over to sell it so it won't be encumbered by your Ch 13.

If you sell the motor and the trustee finds out you sold it without prior permission, that's enough to get your plan dismissed. Of course, you can decide to take the chance, and chances are your trustee may not find out. But what if he/she does? Is it worth it?

[Limitman]

That sucks that the motor is just gonna have to sit around and rust. I don't want to ruin my case that's for sure. Maybe I could find a cheap hull of a boat and put the motor on it or maybe loan it out or something. Thanks

[debtinohio]

I assumed these were listed separately since a boat motor is titled separately from the boat. You surrendered the boat and if the motor was listed separate they knew you were keeping this asset at a set value. Isn't the sale value of this asset already worked into the plan?

[Limitman]

Yes the boat is seperatly listed from the motor. The boat actually has it's own motor that goes with it when it gets surrendered. Yes the trutees knows that I am keeping it as an asset and he didn't make any fuss about it at all. I am paying back 58% to my creditors. I would assume the sale value was worked into the plan, I guess I would have to look into what my plan says. I'm just wondering though...if my plan were to fail lets say 6 months from now due to job loss and I tried to convert to a 7 would the court then try to take the engine and sell it off? The value of this asset will keep going down over time so let's say it's worth $5000 today a year from now it will probably be worth $4000. What happens five years from now when it's worth $1000? Also what happens if said asset gets damaged by accident and it loses it's stated value? The reason I ask this is if I were to find another boat and use the engine and lets say it seizes up or freezes and cracks by accident the asset is no loner worth anything to me and I can't afford to fix what do I do then?

[justbroke]

I have no idea why you were told to wait to sell it then, you have already accounted for it's value whether you sell it for cash or keep it as-is. If the trustee wanted the cash they would have made you surrender it.

Well, was the motor actually exempted? It sounds like no. It sounds like if the Debtor asked the Trustee if they can sell it, the Trustee may want the proceeds.

[debtinohio]

Well, was the motor actually exempted? It sounds like no. It sounds like if the Debtor asked the Trustee if they can sell it, the Trustee may want the proceeds.

Agreed. I assumed it was exempted somehow.