About CC Claims

[goldnsun]

We have our 341 hearing this Thursday and one of our credit cards was not included when our attorney filed our petition. He said it won't matter since CC companies pull your TRW and they will see the bk and file a claim on their own. If this CC company never files a claim, will we still owe them when our bk is discharged in 5 years? If so, will we now have to file an amendment to include them?

Thanks

[justbroke]

You need to include all creditors on your petition. Yes, some of them automatically get notification, because they subscribe to the CRA's service.

However, in a Chapter 13, you need to have all those creditors listed in your Schedules in order to discharge them at the end of your Chapter 13. Otherwise, they can, rightfully, claim that they never received notice and didn't receive any payment (potentially) under the plan, and hence should not be enjoined from continuing to collect the debt.

[goldnsun]

Hmm... well would a good sign that they have been

notified be that we have not received a bill statement from them this past month? We haven't received any CC bills this past month actually and we filed on February 7th. I don't have pacer, I just use the national data base which is a little behind on updating but as of a few weeks ago, this CC is not on the claims.

Thanks!

[goldnsun]

Is this something we could bring up at the 341 hearing to either our attorney or trustee?
We do have one card claim with this CC company in my name but the other card that was forgotten is in my husbands name.
Can I just send the CC company a copy of our petition if the attorney doesn't see the need to file an amendment?
Does the data base only show who was notified but not who actually decided to file a claim? If they get notified by some other way, would it show up in the data base?
If the only proof we have that they were notified is what the petition shows when we filed it, would it legally matter that they were notified in some other way since they could just deny that they were notified?

[goldnsun]

Spoke with the attorney and...

he claims that everyone on our trw's were notified whether it is showing up in the data base or not. Not sure what to do with this information although he said we'll discuss it further at the 341 on Thursday. This happened because when we brought in the statements from creditors, I forgot that one but I knew I forgot it and wrote down what was owed and to whom and whose name it was in and he was supposed to make sure to include it. He had the address since it was a card we were filing on in my name. Since we do have one CC that was filed on with same company, different name, they probably were notified that husband and wife were filing at this address. Plus we have not received any bills for either card in the last month. It should just be a social security number thing for any debt with chapter 13 since all unsecured debt has to be included in the plan anyway. I guess if he doesn't want to file an amendment which he says is not needed, I could at the very least send a copy of the petition to the CC's mailing address with a delivery confirmation, to at least cover ourselves. Plus we are signed up to be able to check our credit report on the fly so we could look at that and determine if they have been notified or not. I just don't want anything stalling our confirmation, dangit!

Thanks for listening.

[BigJohn]

If you mail out a copy of the petition, I don't think it will help much. The creditor has to be added to the matrix. It seems you would be circumventing the system.

[EricaCallaha]

Your attorney needs to file an amendment to add the creditor. Otherwise, it may not be discharged at the end of the bankruptcy. Which means that they will come at you full barrel with all their interest and fees.

As a side note, at your 341 the trustee (or his representative) will ask you if everything is complete and true to your knowledge. Keep in mind that you are under oath. You really don't want this nagging at you later.

Good luck.

[goldnsun]

At the 341....

How about I bring a statement with me of the CC that was left off? I definitely want to include it, just unsure how to go about it if the attorney gives me a problem filing an amendment.

[EricaCallaha]

I would call your attorney again and tell him that this creditor needs to be added. You know for a fact that it was left off and needs to be added into the matrix. If he still balks at amending your schedules then you need to speak with the trustee's office to find out what you can do.

You are going to be under oath at this meeting and you don't want to lie. If your attorney is not going to amend, then you should probably speak at the 341 that you do have one more creditor to be added. In all honesty, your trustee is probably going to object to something in your plan. It is completely routine and nothing to worry about as most objections can be resolved quickly. Adding this creditor is really no big deal and your attorney is just being lazy and irresponsible to not add it in. It is as simple as responding to an objection.

Good luck...341's are nerve racking and awful to anticipate, but we all make it through!

[krielly]

much easier to amend your plan pre confirmation than post confirmation. Cheaper too! Tell your attorney to get of his lazy butt and amend !!!!!

Sorry, couldn't resist. I think the fee in our state for a pre-confirmation amendment is only like $25 or so..........

[EricaCallaha]

Exactly....I 100% agree with KReilly. Tell him to get it done.

[goldnsun]

341 tomorrow but I noticed.....

on the petition for the 341 hearing that we received, that both of our names are on one paper and that same paper stating our plan and the deadlines for objections gets sent to all our creditors as well. Now Capital One, the card in question, would have received one as well with both of our names on it where we carry two accounts at. Since there is no total balance tied to this paper nor does it state whose account this is for, my husbands or mine, wouldn't this work to include both accounts under both our names? I think that was the attorneys view. And he also mentioned about us not getting any bill from them which he is right, we have not. I will be taking a copy of the statement to the 341 tomorrow just in case, my only concern would be that the database only shows a fraction of what we owe them. What can we do if the attorney won't amend? Do it ourselves? Hopefully the 341 will go smooth for us!

[justbroke]

If your attorney used your TRW (Experian) report, it may not have contained all creditors. Check the credit matrix to see if Capitol One was indeed included. If not, you need to amend your schedules. Your lawyer can't refuse that request. However, you will be responsible for paying the fee $26, especially if you failed to notice it earlier.

[goldnsun]

The lawyer originally said...

he would not charge us a cent more than his $3500 original fee for any amendments that may come up during our 13 process. So I will definitely be holding him to that. Actually the other account under Capital One getting left off was his fault since I told him at the meeting when we first filed that I didn't have that statement with me accidentally but I did write down the amount owed and told him to use the other Capital One statement I did bring in to get the address for them. When we came back a few days later and before signing the final paperwork that he had typed up, I pointed out to him that the other Capital One account was not on the paperwork and that's when he said he basically forgot and that it did not matter because they would pull the trw and be notified. Which they were notified for the one amount under my husbands name but the other larger sum account is not on the matrix, only the lesser amount. Does the amount really matter other than showing a final total and what percentage of money everyone will get? Although if our payment stays the same, it looks like unsecureds will be getting next to nothing. So Capital One is included but it does not show the proper amount owed because it is only showing one account. If I bring it up to the trustee and the attorney together and the trustee doesn't have an issue with it, maybe the total doesn't matter. I guess it will be a wait and see. Tomorrow morning at 8 for us. Now I just hope the attorney remembers the lien strip we need!

[EricaCallaha]

I just checked our schedules and almost all the Capital One (7 accounts) was lumped into 3 mailings. Maybe he just combined.

Good luck tomorrow!!!! Remember to breathe. And speak loud and clear.