Filed Pro Se

[justbroke]

Wow, your attorney is high! Mine was only $1400 and I only had to come up with $200 up front I think....and the rest went into the plan...I can't remember exact figures but he was great to work with.

The one attorney I talked to said because it was an "emergency" (being two weeks from sale / foreclosure). Oh well.

[justbroke]

341 Meeting Concluded!

Yep, 341 Meeting Concluded. I didn't even get grilled! I was the absolute last one on the list to have my meeting with the deputy Trustee since other folks had Attorneys. However, people were late, not in the room, or their Attorney was missing, so I actually was NOT the last person! (They separated us into two rooms, one for Chapter 7 and one for Chapter 13). The Chapter 7 people looked nervous.

The questions asked me were:

• Swear to tell the truth.
• Aware that the forms were done under oath and penalty of perjury
• Are the Schedules and Statements correct or do they need modification (I answered that my B22C needs an update but the overall DMI only changed by $50 or so... he was OK with that!)
• Why am I keeping my Investment Property. (Because I want to move into it some day!)

Then he handed me a bunch of envelopes for payments and said that's it and Good Luck!

I even chit chatted with a couple of lawyers outside the court. Some of them were telling their people to go sell their car or abandon it. One guy told me he didn't wear a watch (Lawyer's suggestion). I didn't wear one either. ;)

In any event, I'm listening to the other people get grilled on some things, but overall the deputy Trustee was "nice". There were several "local" creditors at the meeting. One of them asked a Debtor where the car was and if they brought it with them. I thought they were going to take it right there, but no, they just wanted to take pictures to document the condition (for valuation).

I was asked no more questions than anyone with an attorney. They liked my overall package and my Plan (it's thorough with 15 provisions), although they're not sure if I'm committing all my DMI. I've already submitted and was granted my motion on a Wage Deduction Order and I've also filed one Claim Objection and have 2 Motion to Determine Secured Status in my pocket waiting.

I only have 3 claims filed against the case, so nothing is really progressing as quick as I thought it would.

My confirmation hearing is scheduled in September with one evidentiary hearing (for my other Motion to Make Direct Plan Payments to Trustee).

I'm feeling great!

[epiphany]

Congrats JustBroke..that is great news.

Just curious, do you know why the claims were filed against you? Just wondering what criteria they use.

Thanks,
ep

[justbroke]

Congrats JustBroke..that is great news.

Just curious, do you know why the claims were filed against you? Just wondering what criteria they use.

Thanks...

It's a Chapter 13, so creditors, especially unsecured creditors, need to file Claims to get any money from the Estate (from the Trustee).

I don't know why they're taking so long to file claims! I've also read where some Creditors won't subject themselves to the Bankruptcy Court, which filing a Claim does to them.

[epiphany]

It's a Chapter 13, so creditors, especially unsecured creditors, need to file Claims to get any money from the Estate (from the Trustee).

Ah, didn't know that, thanks for the info!

I hope no more of them file claims on you!

ep

[justbroke]

Wow, fastest Order sustaining objections to claims I've even seen! I overnighted 3 objections to claims (I've objected to 4 out of 6 so far), and the court already has sustained my objections for lack of documentation!

These Creditors are crazy with what they submit.

[justbroke]

I'm now 4 for 4 in getting my Objections to claims sustained! It's almost fun in these adversarial-type motions. However, I'm scared, because I was sustained on my objection to a very prominent and fierce law firm. I know they are smart and crafty. (There's another one which has a 30-day negative notice on it, no response yet, so it will be sustained and I'll be 5 for 5.)

A mini-review. I had two claims for some charges from AMEX from 10 and 20 years ago. (Yeah, that's not a typo). I had a claim from some company I never heard of claiming an account I never heard of. I also had another claim from a company with a secured claim, but their docs aren't in order.

The other one is an invalid claim amount on one of my mortgages. I'm not trying to not pay the claim... the problem is that the amount is just wrong. Judge agreed with me so far (not in an evidentiary hearing, but I received an immediate sustainment of the objection).

REMEMBER FOLKS: KEEP UP ON YOUR CLAIMS! Most importantly, just because a lawyer sent the Claim Form and signed it... doesn't mean the amount is ACCURATE!

[No Gravy]

I'm now 4 for 4 in getting my Objections to claims sustained! It's almost fun in these adversarial-type motions. However, I'm scared, because I was sustained on my objection to a very prominent and fierce law firm. I know they are smart and crafty. (There's another one which has a 30-day negative notice on it, no response yet, so it will be sustained and I'll be 5 for 5.)

WOW! Thank you so much for posting your experiences here...I'd have never known a David vs Goliath win was possible before this forum. Go get 'um!

I had two claims for some charges from AMEX from 10 and 20 years ago. (Yeah, that's not a typo).

*blink* Did the judge at least giggle at that?

I had a claim from some company I never heard of claiming an account I never heard of. I also had another claim from a company with a secured claim, but their docs aren't in order.

Amazing, simply amazing.

REMEMBER FOLKS: KEEP UP ON YOUR CLAIMS! Most importantly, just because a lawyer sent the Claim Form and signed it... doesn't mean the amount is ACCURATE!

I know the company who's processing my foreclosure can't be too swift. I've received in the neighborhood of over 20 identical NODs. Got another 9 yesterday. They must be keeping the post office in business.

[justbroke]

More good news. A couple of more claims came through today and one was from a secured creditor (store card). They filed as a general unsecured creditor. So instead of paying them 100% -- to keep my new plasma TV -- they'll get what all the other unsecured creditors are getting.

In hindsight, I should have listed all credit cards (store) as unsecured on my Schedules. In any event, I have a provision in my Plan which states that they'll be treated as unsecured if they file as such.

[No Gravy]

More good news. A couple of more claims came through today and one was from a secured creditor (store card). They filed as a general unsecured creditor. So instead of paying them 100% -- to keep my new plasma TV -- they'll get what all the other unsecured creditors are getting.

In hindsight, I should have listed all credit cards (store) as unsecured on my Schedules. In any event, I have a provision in my Plan which states that they'll be treated as unsecured if they file as such.

I was really surprised when the attorney I spoke with said 2 of my creditors, which I had assumed would be secured, are really unsecured.

One company is CitiFinancial, $11k for new windows for the house, and CitiBank/Home Depot for $18k, most of that was for a new central AC.

Months ago I had nightmarish visions of CitiFinancial "repossessing" my windows because I hadn't paid the bill...

[justbroke]

I was really surprised when the attorney I spoke with said 2 of my creditors, which I had assumed would be secured, are really unsecured.

One company is CitiFinancial, $11k for new windows for the house, and CitiBank/Home Depot for $18k, most of that was for a new central AC.

Months ago I had nightmarish visions of CitiFinancial "repossessing" my windows because I hadn't paid the bill...

Well, I found that CitiFinancial, at least in some parts of the Country, fail to perfect their security interest. So, they don't have a leg to stand on when it comes to a secured debt.

I've read somewhere, in all my readings, that hardly any of the store cards come after you as secured, unless you spent a lot of money real recently. I haven't spent money on my "store" cards (Lowe's, Home Depot, furniture, etc) in 1-3 years... with most over 3 years ago.

The Bankruptcy Law Network (http://www.************************) is pretty good for posting different decisions and techniques used by various Lawyers throughout the country.. I haven't found a similar one (other than the ABI). That's if you like to read, and is a great resource for pro se filers.

[No Gravy]

Well, I found that CitiFinancial, at least in some parts of the Country, fail to perfect their security interest. So, they don't have a leg to stand on when it comes to a secured debt.

I have wondered about how they calculate their interest. I only questioned it because about a year into the contract I got a letter saying that during an internal audit they found that my monthly payment had been set too low, and that during the next billing cycle it would be adjusted. I went back through my statements from them...and the figures I came up with were radically different than theirs.

I always meant to go back through the statements and make sense of them...but my life got crazy for a while, and I never had the time. Doesn't matter now, anyway.

I've read somewhere, in all my readings, that hardly any of the store cards come after you as secured, unless you spent a lot of money real recently. I haven't spent money on my "store" cards (Lowe's, Home Depot, furniture, etc) in 1-3 years... with most over 3 years ago.

Luckily my furniture was paid off almost 2 years ago, but Home Depot....yeah. Did a lot of business with them, due to remodeling my house. Last time I shopped there was May, and nothing then that would be "repo-able", unless they repo air conditioning units. I'm actually surprised they don't put a lien on the house, since it's now a part of the house. Not that it matters, I'm $100k upside down...

The Bankruptcy Law Network (http://www.************************) is pretty good for posting different decisions and techniques used by various Lawyers throughout the country.. I haven't found a similar one (other than the ABI). That's if you like to read, and is a great resource for pro se filers.

Excellent resource, thank you! I've been reading and absorbing as much as I possibly can. Some of the BK code is confusing, since the key it seems is in the interpretation of the law, and not the written law itself. Interpretation of the law can only come from experience.

OTOH, I think I'm up for the challenge of doing this myself. *crosses fingers*

Thanks again for that link and the pointers!

[JRScott]

Sounds like you are doing great

Good Luck

[justbroke]

My case file organization!!! Thought I'd share my filing system for other people who may attempt pro se.

I have a well organized directory structure on my PC. I back it up DAILY as I have filed pro se and my entire case and history are there.

Here's how I have mine set up (NOTE: the "00" and "01" numbers are for SORTING purposes.):

• 00 00 Pending Motions -- these are "shortcuts" to actual pending documents (which stay in their respective folder)
• 00 00 CASE XX-XXXXX-XXX -- contains everything filed and received from PACER (notices, orders, etc)
• 00 01 FOR TRUSTEE -- for the Trustee
• 00 01 TO DO - IMPORTANT -- Other Than Motions, Objections
• 00 02 PLAN -- The Plan
• 00 03 CLAIMS -- Claims (see below)
• 00 04 FILED -- Documents FILED with the Court (organized into sub-folder with the date -- e.g. 20080824)
• 00 05 MOTIONS -- Drafts of Motions
• 00 88 STATE STATUTES -- Statutes
• 00 99 OTHER -- Junk

The CLAIMS folder is organized by Claims. It looks like this

• 01 - SOME CREDITOR NAME #1
  • DOCUMENTATION -- contains the actual claim and supporting documentation submitted by the creditor
  • OBJECTION -- ONLY if I objected to it
  • NO OBJECTION -- A Blank Folder if NOT objected to
• 02 - SOME CREDITOR NAME #2
  • DOCUMENTATION
  • NO OBJECTION
• 03 - SOME CREDITOR NAME #3
  • DOCUMENTATION
  • OBJECTION

The first number is the Claim number filed. So claim number 1 get folder "01 - SOME CREDITOR #1". The numbers are used for "sorting" the folder! Keeps them in order. Inside of each CLAIM folder I do two things.

That's pretty much it for the organization. I also have a master Spreadsheet which tracks money I spent on delivery (service) to creditors, attorneys and other contact information. I also have a Form B22C in a spreadsheet to do quick what-if calculations, as well as a "payments" spreadsheet which will also tell me what happens if I modify a payment to a creditor.

Notice!!! When using PACER, it will save files with the SAME filename. The standard filename on pacer is opn_view.pdf. When you save it, make sure to use a name which represents what it is. I usually use the "CAPTION" information on the document (e.g. ABC BANK OBJECTION TO CONFIRMATION OF PLAN.pdf).

Let's see... more things to note. I have the Federal Rules of Bankruptcy Procedure bookmarked into my browser

[url]http://www.law.cornell.edu/rules/frbp[/url]

Of course, I have my local District's site as well. The Bookmarks are organized too for easy finding. Don't just have a bunch of bookmarks laying around, you'll never find stuff that way.

Okay, I'm crazy... I know... but you MUST stay organized if you're a pro se filer, and it doesn't hurt to be organized if you have a lawyer.

[No Gravy]

Okay, I'm crazy... I know...

Crazy like a fox!

but you MUST stay organized if you're a pro se filer, and it doesn't hurt to be organized if you have a lawyer.

I've always believed in dazzling 'um with paperwork (and always have more documentation than is called for), in any situation that calls for it. I remember the first time I refinanced my house and was asked to bring in some paperwork. I did, all in binders with color-coded sections, etc. The mortgage broker's eyes glazed over...and she asked me if i would come to her house and organize her files.

We later became personal friends, and whenever she'd introduce me she said "OMG, you should SEE this girl's paperwork!" LOL! there are other talents I'd rather be known for....but whatever

Excellent suggestion on backing up local files. One can never back up too much.

I also have a master Spreadsheet which tracks money I spent on delivery (service) to creditors, attorneys and other contact information.

OK, I have to ask. Are these charges tax deductible, or is it for another reason? I've saved all my expenses also, but haven't gotten to the point of researching if they are deductible or otherwise of use to me.