Sigh, new to this

[SwimminUpStream]

Uggh, as many of you, we have come to the realization that we need to file Chap. 13. Well, we have to file 13 since here in the lovely State of Fla. we make way too much money for anything else.

CC debt, RV payment, med bills and obviously some very poor choices by us have landed us in this position.

We hired an atty in Feb. and paid him, just got a call yesterday and our plan payback in $ 2066/mo. YIKES. This does not include our mtg. as we are not behind on that or anything else, until Feb. when they told us to stop paying CC's and 2 unsecured personal loans.

They told me I was in the 100% payback...works out to like 123,000 over the 5 years.

Mind you we DO want to pay our debts, but this leaves us the GRAND TOTAL of 121-/mo after repayment and mtg, living expenses. It DOES NOT cover all my medical expenses and they said well, too bad, we have to go by the median...HOLY COW.

Am I missing something here....or is this just how it is and our problem for getting ourselves into this mess to begin with? It almost seems like you are set up to fail, not succeed. I do not need 2 million a month extra, but a tad more than 121 would be nice and needed.

[laurannm]

Is that positive or negative $121?

What is your income and unsecured debts, and other living expenses? That payment seems a tad high. How big is your family?

[lrprn]

Given the information you've provided, it sounds like your lawyer didn't help you pre-plan your Ch 13 very well if you are left with so little money after paying your basic expenses.

Most of us have been hanging on by a financial thread for so long before filing, if we plug in our actual expenses from the last year before filing, it doesn't come close to reflecting what we need to actually live on for five years. We haven't gone to the doctor, bought clothes, had any entertainment....you get the picture.

Most times an experienced Ch 13 lawyer will set expenses in Ch 13 to what is reasonable in your community so you can survive your plan for five years. Did that happen in your case?

If you are set up in a plan that you know will fail from the onset, what's the point of filing? Costs are only going to go up over the next five years. If you're starting in the hole, how can you make it to the end and be discharged?

Please do not sign your form and file until you have this discussion with your lawyer!

[SwimminUpStream]

I thought it was high...it is a positive $ 121-/mo.

My income (ours) is 5539-/net per month

My unsecured debt is about 85-90K, and my car is also going to be in there, so throw in another 30K.

[SwimminUpStream]

I have yet to sign anything...We did "pad" things, but it just did not work out. I have high medical bills (after insurance pays their portion) and I was told too bad...IRS allows only 55-/mo. The only thing padded is there is $ 225- in there for misc. expenses which does help defray my medical costs of $ 300 per month. But I agree with you, there is no room for anything else.

I see no other way out of this, then what they set up. They said they have to follow the standard in our area.

[laurannm]

How big your family, and how does your monthly living expenses look? We just spoke to a lawyer the other day; we have a family of 5 with both income\unsecured debt in excess of $100k, but given our expenses we are still looking at a Chapter 7 (after our schedule I & J were completed).

Of course, every situation is different...

[SwimminUpStream]

We will be filing in the Orlando BK court area.

[SwimminUpStream]

There is only 2 of us. Our Mtg is 950-/mo, food is 600-, electric 250-, taxes 120-,cell's 75- , cable 70-, Gas 350-, Medical 300, Life Ins. 25-, home phone 56-, Insurance (cars/house) 200-. That is our basic expenses..

[SANRA308]

5539-2066=3473,minus the above listed 2996=477 left over. our net monthly income is about 500 less than yours and we are a family of 4, We pay 1100 a month, so the 2066 does sound high but probably right. You can tell your attorney you need more to cover the medical cost, but you will need to prove your cost and that the cost will continue to be that high for the 5 years. We sumbited all our medical records for 6 months, presciption, dental, glasses ect. we were asking for 300 a month, only ended up with 150even though we had proof of cost.However I do think we are better off 1100 a month is still less than we were paying and in 5 years we are debt free. We also have that ever valuable leson of learning to live without credit cards. You also might check with a CCC if you must pay back 100% and you are not trying to save your house or anything, might work out better, since you still have the control not the trustee.

[SwimminUpStream]

Before I hired an atty...I did check with CCC, and they told me br was the way to go. I also need to get out from under a 635- RV payment. I did submit proof of all the medical, but to no avail. There is no 100% proof I will still be treating this disease 5 years from now. We sure would like to hope not, but 2 years ago we did not think we would still be treating now, so who really knows...not even the Dr's.

Anyway, I guess we just bite the bullet and go from here. Before with all my expenses, we were 1306- in the hole...So I guess this is better...in the end. Just seemed so very high. I would have liked to see them leave just a little left over, like maybe $ 300- per month.

[MajorMike]

You spend 600/mo on the two of you for food??? what do you eat?? LOL
We were allowed only $300 for the two of us and even that was high. Thats nice that you were allowed that.
It still seems a bit high but you do make a lot of money if it's almost 6K net a month.

[SwimminUpStream]

Also, at this point, I have paid the atty. 1300-, and now I have to pay him another 400- to file something to do with our home "outside" the plan. Sigh, so we have sunck money into this and seems foolish to waste that now.

[SwimminUpStream]

I guess you are not the one to grocery shop Mike. When was the last time you bought a dozen eggs or a gallon of milk? Not sure where you live, but food prices do vary from state to state. That also includes, cleaning supplies, tp, etc along with dog and cat food. There are some weeks I do not spend that...then others when I do. Depends on what I have to buy during that time. Also, I have food allergies and can only eat certain foods and that makes it VERY difficult.

I guess one should not judge until they have walked in your shoes.

[SANRA308]

cost also varies greatly on where you live, my understanding is orlando is on the high side, also the IRS standards allow $528 a month for 2 people for food, $300 a month is low, you should get the $961 that the IRS allows for food and personal care ect, your attorney should allow you the national standard amount

[woeisme]

My attorney allowed us to take $300 per month for medical expenses since my husband has a chronic condition that requires treatments. We just had to show that is what we have been paying. Your lawyer is either too lazy to fight with the trustee on this issue for you, or your local trustee is known to always refuse to budge on it, not sure which. But we have about the same income as you (3 people instead of 2) and about the same debt level. We have a $1100 a month plan at 65% payback because in addition to adding our real medical costs we were able to take daycare costs, which also helped a lot, and the trustee even let me put $3000 a year into my medical savings account to cover prescription drugs (we have about $100 a month costs there) and dental and optical stuff in addition to my husbands treatments. So there are definitely precedents for allowing more than the bare minimum in medical if you can prove the costs are on-going. Keep pressing your attorney to at least try to get these costs included in your budget, if the trustee never even sees the numbers, of course you're not going to get them allowed, but you have to at least start with the very real expenses and negotiate from there. Good luck!