First time poster. Questions on Chpt 13

[JasonK94Z]

I've been doing a lot of research on CCCS and Chapter 13 lately. We are planning on filing Chapter 13, and have our first appt with an attny next Friday.

I ran into the IRS National Standards for Allowable Living Expenses today. We are a family of 4. My Gross monthly is $5200.
So looking at this form, I am seeing figures staed for food, housekeeping supplies, apparel&services, etc. Here: http://www.usdoj.gov/ust/eo/bapcpa/2...anstesting.htm

Are these the figures I am allowed to use when putting together my budget? Or is this something my lawyer will follow when putting everything together?

Maybe we have just been living it rough, but some of these figures are nice!

Also, the Local Housing and Utilities Standards for Alabama (Baldwin County). Is that held true for my house? If so, My mortgage is more than the listed. What happens? Will I be required to show proof of my electric bill, water bill, etc?

And what about transportation costs?

Thanks everyone!!

[JasonK94Z]

44 views, no replies? Hello? Anyone here?

[HenriettaHen]

Jason, sometimes nobody has come along yet who knows the answer!

And I can only answer part of this:

You should gather up all your actual bills - these are your true expenses.

The attorney will use the IRS tables in conjunction with the expense information you've given him, to figure your expenses for the petition, and he
will deal with all of that.

The figures that you use for your BUDGET should be the actual amounts you really pay. Your budget is a live model that you create to live by in the future. You don't spend more than you make.

The trick is to get your Chap 13 plan to be REALISTIC.

You've done a good job of digging into the Standards. Ask your attorney how he will be applying the Local Standards for Alabama to your case.

Let us know what he says.

[BKTango]

The allowables are a guideline but in a ch 13 your real expenses are what's key. Your lawyer would know better how things are handled in Alabama than I personally would. I believe the standards are worked into your means test as a general guide. Your real expenses are worked into your budget, that will determine how much disposable income you do have left over every month.

There is a free means test online, that will give you a rough estimate, it also allows for adjustment for higher mortgages and such.

http://www.legalconsumer.com/means-t...ator/index.php

Maybe some one who has filed a chapter 13 can come along and give you some better advice.

[JasonK94Z]

Thanks everyone for the answers so far. I gues I'm just freaking out over here.

[Granny]

Here in Tx, my Sch J, which is the budget, is based on my actual expenses and what the local trustee will allow. Unfortunately, this is not the same as the standards. However, on a positive note, there are areas such as child care, charity allowances, entertainment, dry cleaning etc that are listed above what I actually spend so I have some room for play. For instance, I was allowed nothing beyond my gasoline cost for transportation, so there's nothing in the budget for repairs. Our vehicles are paid for, but both have 80k miles on them. They won't last 5 more years, and there will certainly be repairs in the future. Since public transportation is not available to us, I have to save the funds from the padded areas to cover expenses that were not budgeted for, like the car repairs.

You attorney will know best where to pad the budget and where to cut it. The standards are a good place to start, but be prepared for them to be whittled down as other areas are increased. The important thing is to account for expenses that are not necessarily recurring, such as auto registration, school clothes and school supplies that are bought in the summer.

Good Luck

[HHM]

The allowable expenses are guidelines. In essence they would like this...

If your "actual" expenses exceed the allowable expenses, then you have some explaining to do, and your "actual" expenses are presumed excessive, and therefore may be objectionable.

If your actual expenses are below the allowable expenses, then nothing really happens.

Last I heard, in a chapter 13 context, you DO NOT get to claim the full amount of the "allowable" if your actual does not equal that amount. But, there is some wiggle room as "Granny" pointed out. Also, there are expenses you can claim that do not have IRS guidelines associated with them.

In any event, given that there is some variation from district to district on this issue, you would need to speak to a local attorney.

[JasonK94Z]

So I take it my attorney won't mind helping us "pad" our budget some to allow for some savings in case of emergency? Things come up sometimes like stated above, and you have to have some funds to cover it.

Are all Chpt 13's 5 yrs now? No more 3 yr ones?

[HenriettaHen]

Welllll.... I wouldn't count on THAT exactly. That would be fraud. However, you will want to work with your attorney on making sure that your plan reflects real-life conditions.

[lrprn]

Are all Chpt 13's 5 yrs now? No more 3 yr ones?

The only 36 month plans confirmed now are for folks that are very close to the median income for their state but still show $160/month disposable income on the Means Test. That's a small % of the total Ch 13 filers. Thanks to the revised bankruptcy law, now most Ch 13 plans will go for 60 months.

[wayne-o]

my attorney did not help me pad my budget, but he helped me realize that my actualy expenses were probably more than what I was thinking. Little things like laundry supplies, haircuts, toiletries add up quick.

[tofargone]

if you are like what we were you skipped out on a lot of things when you were tight on money so the BK allowances look like a lot. I have to admit that we have a lot more disposable income now then before we filed. It is really going to depend on how much your trustee wants to dig and how much of a payback you are submitting. Mine came out to 70% now 100% due to a couple of creditors not filling. If we were at 0% or 10% they may have been a lot stricter on us.

Good luck

[JasonK94Z]

Thanks everyone. My first appointment with our attny is next Friday Aug 3rd. I hope she is good. I'll continue to do research in the mean time.

Can I change my car insurance AFTERWARDS? That would be an easy way to cut costs to save some cash while in BK. I know Geico will save me a good chunk of change.

[tofargone]

I would be leary on the car insurance side, I have read several posts where their rates rose after bankruptcy..... I guess we are at a higher risk.....

[HenriettaHen]

If you're current with your regular insurance agent, the extra few bucks you pay there could translate to a local business relationship that survives bankruptcy ... this could be valuable, so consider that.

Rather than potluck after bankruptcy with a little green naked talking computer lizard.

Just sayin'.