Anyone have kids in college when they filed?

[CA3kids]

We are assuming the only way for my son to get loans or aid for college in his name (he will be starting his second year, 2nd child supposed to start a year from this fall) will be for us to file -- since we can't take on any more debt right now since we can't make our minimums without borrowing from other cards, etc. So... we are trying to file this summer, even though it's not the best time, financially (ie, our 6 mos income would be much less if we waited until next February), so that he can continue college. Right now the FAFSA says our expected contribution will be 20K - last year it was supposed to be 25K. hahahaha.

I've already talked to his school and the fin. aid dept said to fill out a "Professional Judgement" form for consideration, but wouldn't give me any idea of what they will do.

I can't find anything on the web in bankruptcy sites or financial aid sites on this, except references to loans and aid *after* you've discharged bk, not while your're in it!

Has anyone had experience with this? Any suggestions?

Thanks!

[SinkingFast]

The "Professional Judgement" application may be something specific to the school your Son is attending. A form you fill out for consideration by your Son's School's Financial Aid office.

We have 3 in College and we haven't applied for any type of Loans to pay for our kids' tuition, books, or fees. We fill out the FAFSA. Two have taken Stafford Loans. One got scholarship. They pick up the rest of what they need by working.

We figure we contribute as much as we can. They still live at home so they don't pay rent. We provide the cars they drive and pay the auto insurance. We feed them and provide all their insurances. We pay all their medical/dental/vision bills, the auto repairs, buy them some clothes on occassion, and such. We even throw in a tank full of gas from time to time.

Trust me when I say,.......... All that adds up to a lot of contribution!

[lrprn]

Our daughter was starting her last year of a three-year post-secondary technical school for therapeutic massage therapy certification when we filed. We explained to the school's financial aid officer that we were in Ch 13 and weren't able to contribute anything - all our disposable income was going towards our monthly trustee payment. He told us that we must complete the FAFSA forms anyway. There is nowhere on these forms to indicate we are in bankruptcy. The financial aid officer asked us to give him a letter stating that we were in Ch 13 and although the FAFSA forms indicated we were able to contribute, in reality we were not. Our daughter ended up getting her own Stafford loan with an increased amount due to our bankruptcy, plus the school helped her consolidate her student loans for the previous two years as well. In the end all worked out, but frankly the federal student loan system is completely inconsistent as far as parent bankruptcy is concerned. You are at the mercy of the school's financial aid office and how understanding they decide to be towards your student. The inconsistency between how schools treat this situation is why you can't find much of anything online about it.

Hope this helped a little. Good luck and please keep us posted on what happens in your family.

[CindyLou]

When I was in college my parents were in financial difficulty. Even though their income for the previous 2 years (which is what they look at) was high, the financial aide officer was able to override the paperwork and I was able to obtain grants. Also, he suggested my parents not claim me on their income tax. They ammened the year we were in to not include me and therefor he only had to override the next year and then the last 2 years were based on my income only. That is the key, not to claim the child and then your income is not considered. But in the case of BK the financial aide officer has the ability to help you out.
Good luck.

[SinkingFast]

That is the key, not to claim the child and then your income is not considered. But in the case of BK the financial aide officer has the ability to help you out.
Good luck.

Thanks for the tip, Cindy!!

You are so right, Lrprn. About the FAFSA.

There's no where on there to explain about filing BK. And it doesn't seem to matter to them that we have 3,....... that's THREE,....... kids in college.

I think I'll need to make a trip to the Financial Aid Office with our BK paperwork and see if we can get some extra assistance for the kids this year.

[CA3kids]

If we could have him declared independent, we would do that to help him (and the next two coming up), but the laws for being an independent student have changed drastically since I was in college and was considered independent. It's very difficult to be declared independent now.

From the federal govt. website for the FAFSA,

http://www.fafsa.ed.gov/help/fftoc01k.htm

here is the information on declaring independent status:

"For federal financial aid purposes, you are considered dependent if you can answer No to all of these questions:

* Were you born before January 1, 1984?
* At the beginning of the school year 2007-2008, will you be working on a master's or doctorate program (such as an MA, MBA, MD, JD, Ph.D., Ed.D., graduate certificate, etc.)?
* As of today, are you married?
* Do you have children who receive more than half of their support from you?
* Do you have dependents other than your children or spouse who live with you and receive more than half of their support from you, now and through June 30, 2008?
* Are (a) both of your parents deceased, or (b) are you (or were you until age 18) a ward/dependent of the court?
* Are you currently serving on active duty in the U.S. Armed Forces for purposes other than training?
* Are you a veteran of the U.S. Armed Forces?

Dependent

You must provide information about your parents when applying for federal student aid.

Independent

You are considered an independent student if you can answer Yes to any (my emphasis) of the questions above."

I just have to hope he can get loans in his own name, because they are already giving him half tuition plus an additional scholarship and I don't think he can get more scholarships. We'll have to pray for a generous financial aid department! At this point, we are filing now (rather than in six or eight months) mostly because if we don't, the school will expect us to take out more PLUS loans, which we definitely can't do. Asking for help is difficult for me, but I am realizing that if he's going to finish at his current college, he will need assistance from someone besides his parents -- or at least hefty loans!

[lrprn]

Just a caution to all of our parents here who are struggling to ensure our kids can still achieve their dreams while we are in bk....we have had several debtors here on the boards who finished college, got their degree, and afterwards were so overwhelmed by their student loan debt that they have ended up nearly destitute. Worse, since student loans aren't dischargeable in bk, they are stuck. Think this is unusual? Read the transcript from 60 Minutes several years ago when they exposed Sallie Mae as a predatory lender - http://ed.stanford.edu/suse/news-bur...usenews&id=154

In many situations it could be better for students to take a year off and work full time or carry a half load while working to pay some of their school costs rather than to depend solely on student loans to make up what we can't pay for as parents in bk.

Here's a federal student loan calculator to help figure out how long it will take to pay off student loans balances - http://www.finaid.org/calculators/loanpayments.phtml . It can be sobering to say the least.

[CA3kids]

[CA3kids]

In many situations it could be better for students to take a year off and work full time or carry a half load while working to pay some of their school costs rather than to depend solely on student loans to make up what we can't pay for as parents in bk.

Here's a federal student loan calculator to help figure out how long it will take to pay off student loans balances - http://www.finaid.org/calculators/loanpayments.phtml . It can be sobering to say the least.

Thanks for that extra piece to think about - I sure don't want him in our situation when he graduates!

[JollyGG]

Actually CA3kids I'm glad you posted the requirements, because it agrees with what I remember from when I was in school. My parents looked at even legally emancipating me at 17 so that I could qualify for better financial aid. However, we discovered that even that would not have changed me having to put their income on the FASA application. My parents made good money but also had lots of debt. They helped out when they could, but it wasn't much. So I went to a state school, got involved a program that allowed me to get instate tuition, worked summers for spending money, was a Resident Assistant for free room and board, and used student loans to pay for classes. When I wrote that check to the school every fall for tuition I knew I earned it and I deserved to be there. It felt great. Also as a resident assistant I noticed that the students who did the worst in school were the students who had parents paying for everything.

[DeadManCrawling]

"For federal financial aid purposes, you are considered dependent if you can answer No to all of these questions:

* Were you born before January 1, 1984?
* At the beginning of the school year 2007-2008, will you be working on a master's or doctorate program (such as an MA, MBA, MD, JD, Ph.D., Ed.D., graduate certificate, etc.)?
* As of today, are you married?
* Do you have children who receive more than half of their support from you?
* Do you have dependents other than your children or spouse who live with you and receive more than half of their support from you, now and through June 30, 2008?
* Are (a) both of your parents deceased, or (b) are you (or were you until age 18) a ward/dependent of the court?
* Are you currently serving on active duty in the U.S. Armed Forces for purposes other than training?
* Are you a veteran of the U.S. Armed Forces?

You GOTTA be kidding

So to qualify, you would be:

An married, orphaned active-duty military person older than 27 years old with children who lived with you while you work on a graduate degree to become a Dr. or lawyer, etc?

Just a guess, but that might let 12 people nationwide qualify, since many of our military are overseas.

HEH, I missed the second part that allows you to answer YES to ANY question.

For a moment, I imagined we were living in Stalin's Russia.

I would suggest the child find the love of his/her life ASAP and run to the courthouse to get married.

If their Romeo/Juliet isn't ont he doorstep right now, I would look for another student with the same situation, and get married for the hell of it, to make this go away. But then again, he/she may not be so desperate as I would in the same situation.

-I am no longer Dumbfounded

DMC

[wrinkleigh]

More than likely, your child wont be declared independant just because of the parent situation. It is VERY difficult to have a student under the age of 24 declared independant.

The professional judgement form basically takes into consideration loss of job, income etc that happeened since the time the FAFSA was filled out. IE your fafsa was filled out using 2006 income figures, but in 2007 you lose a job, so those numbers can be decreased. That is the ONLY consideration that you will be given, is sudden loss of income -- circumstanced just dont matter to them. So unless you qualify that way, the professional judgement will not do you any good.

Your student will be awarded grants/scholarships/loans based on your FAFSA. Loan amounts are based on student status (Freshman, Soph, JR, SR). SO go ahead and take out the max there. They will tell you student cant take out any more loans in his/her name BUT if your award package just does not cover cost, you can apply for a parent plus loan. This loan is for the students benefit, but in parents name based on the parents credit. If you have bk looming over you, you will not be approved. Here is the kicker -- once you have applied and been denied, the student is automatically entitled to additional unsub loans, up to the cost of attendance at your school. They may not tell you this upfront.

Also -- that parent portion of the cost of attendance is just an estimate -- and in most cases is WAY beyond what you will actually need to contribute. So dont panic just yet.

[CindyLou]

First hand experience here that the Student Loan Officer DOES have the power to override the status. May differ from school to school, but mine was more that willing to help in our situation!

[wrinkleigh]

CLS --

Hope your school does not get caught in an audit situation. Federal regs are VERY clear.

Schools can do whatever they want -- until they get caught.