No plan heading into confirmation hearing

[eap82]

Hi Again. As I have posted before, I still don't have a confirmed plan and have an upcoming confirmation meeting. My lawyer wants to hold off on filing another amended plan and instead will go into the meeting with the trustee and hash it out I guess. The idea is to avoid another continuance. Anyone have any experience with this?

[justbroke]

This is how it works in Florida. It's known as the "rocket docket" in the (Florida) bankruptcy court. Before the court goes into open session, with the judge present, the Trustee and his/her assistants sit at the tables and the attorneys or debtors line up in front of the Trustee (or his/her assistant), and review the case in real time. It works very well and is very informal. Once the Trustee (or his/her attorney assistant) talks to the attorney representing the debtor they make a note and agree on what will happen "on the record."

Once that is all done, the courtroom deputy will ask the judge to enter the courtroom. Then the court will be in session and they will go through the docket. Most of the things will be "read into the record" when the court is in session with the judge present. This allows for a very quick adjudication of most things... like a rocket.

If the Trustee and the debtor's attorney were able to reach an agreement "at the table" then it will just be read into the record when the case is called. It actually saves a bunch of time.

[eap82]

justbroke Makes a lot of sense actually. It just makes me uneasy as I wasn't going to be there to speak for myself. Maybe I need to try and get the day off of work? What if my attorney doesn't have all my numbers straight and I get screwed into a payment I can't pay? As I've expressed before, I've lost faith in them and that they can keep the details straight. Would I be allowed to speak during the discussion or do I just listen?

[justbroke]

There are 0 reasons for a represented debtor to be present at a confirmation hearing.

As I wrote in an earlier thread, confirmation takes time and can easily be 10-12 months in Florida... or longer. You just keep making your payments as required. The confirmation just confirms your plan and your payment schedule and so long as nothing materially changes, you just keep paying as you have. There is generally nothing to worry about.

Additionally, you can't speak at all. You are represented. Unless there is an evidentiary hearing that requires you to appear and/or testify under oath, there are no reasons to attend any court hearing.

As for your nervousness or concerns about the payment... you paid your attorney to worry about that and to negotiate with the Trustee.

[eap82]

justbroke Thanks for all your help. It does help me feel a little less worried. I just hope my attorney can negotiate a reasonable plan. Overall I don't know what to think about my trustee so I'll just have to roll with it. 47 more payments to go!

[justbroke]

I know it's tough since, outside the 341 Meeting, a represented debtor has no interaction with the court, never sees the judge, or attends the confirmation hearing. In a perfect world the original plan is confirmed as submitted. There are very few plans that are confirmed as they were originally written. Many go through several draft versions. I was on Amended Plan #4 which was ultimately confirmed; that's 5 plan submissions to address various issues from the Trustee and the creditors.

I can also tell you that your attorney will never know your numbers, expenses, and the intricate details as you will ever know. They attempt to summarize it as best as the computer software (usually Best Case Bankruptcy), or they can manage. It's difficult because Florida uses a "model" plan and no one ever wants to deviate from that plan. Getting the opportunity to address the Chapter 13 Trustee (or his/her assistant attorney) directly is almost always easy to settle things!

My trustee has 3 staff attorneys, not including themself. I had an issue which I went back and forth with my Chapter 13 Trustee's attorney (an assistant to the trustee that actually handles part of the caseload). Even with emails, it was not getting through. I went to the "continued" confirmation hearing and lo and behold, we had a meeting of the minds when I was able to speak with the assistant in person. My case was confirmed on the rocket docket that day (read into the record). I waited around and the judge was impressed that I was confirmed.

I will tell you, though, my case was continued several times and it took 5 plans to get it confirmed. I knew it would ultimately be confirmed, but the details and requirements of a confirmable plan are much different than what we usually anticipate. What seems minor to we, as debtors, are big deals for the Chapter 13 Trustee and the creditors.

[flashoflight]

Let your lawyer do his job. You might not get 100% of what you want, but that is the art of compromise and the cost of doing business.

Under ideal circumstances, your lawyer will not allow you to put expenses and other things in the plan that the trustee will outright refuse. Over time, the lawyer builds rapport and trust with the various assistant trustees so that there is no funny business in any of the lawyer's cases. That makes it simpler when the lawyer and the trustee sends email back and forth trying to get all of the lawyer's cases on the rocket docket or AKA consent calendar. Because my district is so busy, the first confirmation hearing is almost a year away and the confirmation date is moved up as cases go to consent.

My plan ended up being the same exact amount as the initial submission. I submitted all receipts prior to the filing so the numbers are backed up. There was one amended plan to fix a minor error. It process works. I did a MOMOD too and it sailed right through. Ezpz.