Complicated....long post. So lost right now.

[amreynolds]

OK, so my confirmation hearing is 7/18/16. Today I get a letter from the Trustee (she is a real hardass) stating even though I am in a 100% plan with interest...I have about $771.00 extra in disposable income I am not giving to her (something here is not adding up because no way we have that extra $$$), says my plan is "underfunded" and if my mortgage creditor decides to go after a deficiency (who knows when or if they will) there is no $$$ for that provision. She does not feel I am excercisng my "best effort" or an in "good faith".

I hit the roof! My attorney is to call me tomorrow.....I can't sleep!

SO....let me add, when I filed my initial petition, we included my future husband's income and expenses and combined it all, as we were scheduled to marry 8/5/16. Sort of preempting as to not have to amend after confirmation.

Tonight, in light of this, we talked and decided to postpone getting married until after this BIK is over. (we are older and its no big deal to wait)......SO, redoing I & J with only myself...I am in the red! That is even not putting down anything for rent (the house is the fiancé's).....

The way the bills are divied up (and I can prove it all)....I am deficient for disposable income on paper (allowing what I can for amounts of bills and such)....

SO, when I talk to Mr. Attorney tomorrow and tell him the wedding is off and we have to amend my finances......how will this work?

Can he amend it to reflect just my income and monthly expenses?
Do I have to start all over again (341...)
Does the timeline change for the bar dates since I do not think I will be in a 100% plan.

If I have no disposable income but make too much for a chapter 7 ...what happens??????? Can someone NOT be able to claim bankruptcy????
I have heard of people converting to a 7....when in a 13....how does that happen??? I made over the Means test allowable in Idaho, just with my income alone as well.

Any help or insight is greatly needed and appreciated.

[justbroke]

You just amend it. Whether or not this will satisfy the Trustee is another story, as to whether you are doing your best effort and/or whether your plan is filed with good faith. Your attorney will have to answer all those questions because we just don't know.

Plans are amended frequently prior to confirmation. Things change and certainly you now have a change. I don't know if I would have combined things up front for something not a certainty but the strategy works in some cases (I filed before being married, married three months after filing, and I did combine things up front).

I have personally converted from a Chapter 13 to a Chapter 7, but my Chapter 13 already showed that my disposable income was negative, so the Trustee put up little if any "fight".

[amreynolds]

Justbroke,

How can one do a 13 if disposable income is negative from the get go?

My poor fiancé just doesn't want to be involved in this financial crap...and I don't blame him. We were to marry in August, but it is now not happening.

This Trustee really digs...she should be an IRS auditor...but I think she is worse.

No way I can stay in this 100% plan just me alone. I am not even claiming I pay rent and I am still in the red by $200.00.....not sure I could even convert to a 7 if I make over the means test.

Just have no idea how this will play out.

Satisfy the Trustee? The wedding is called off....he wants no part of this....what can she do? If she tosses my case out (dismisses it)...then what?????

[amreynolds]

So, I am calmer and have done a new I & J with just my income...seems I was upset last night and did it wrong. I do have disposable income, but it is only like $525.00. This will alter my plan from a 100% case. I will await to hear from my attorney to see how we will proceed. This is the worst thing I have ever been through to date. It doesn't help that my attorney never calls me back even when I am told he will.

[justbroke]

Justbroke, How can one do a 13 if disposable income is negative from the get go?

It is just the way the means test is designed as it captured a 2nd mortgage that was stripped. I was definitely in the negative before filing.

Sorry to read of your wedding postponement, but you may be making a better financial decision in this manner; only time will tell. The only reason to really I can see to file a Chapter 13 is if you are protecting property (or staving off one or more lawsuits that could result in a judgment). That doesn't mean everyone gets to file Chapter 7 since it was made clear that Congress wanted more people in Chapter 13.

As for the Trustee, this is what they do. Their job is to investigate your financial life and to make sure that, especially in the case of a Chapter 13, you are committing all of your disposable income to the Plan unless you are paying 100% of the unsecured claims. Remember that a Chapter 13 is a little slow paced and attorneys seldom return calls immediately (or even with days). A typical Chapter 13 confirmation can take 6-12 months in many districts.

[amreynolds]

I WAS in a 100% plan WITH 4% interest to boot. The payment covered EVERYTHING....but she still wants every dime she can. Its hard enough now with it is what it is currently. She is also wanting me to pay into it for the possibility when the mortgage creditor sells the home, for me to cover any possible deficiency! That may not even happen, and do not even know how much that could be.
My fiancée just doesn't want to be involved with this mess financially and said if not getting married is what it takes, then that's what he wants. I don't blame him, he didn't ask for this.
SO....I emailed my attorney the above and he asked if we were still going to reside together (we do currently). I said yes. Then his paralegal calls me 3 hours later to set up an appointment to come in next Monday. I asked what he wants to discuss, and she said "I don't know, that's why your coming in, but we can do things on our end." What kind of response is THAT?
I know they see stuff all the time, I know my panic is not their panic...but geez....this is not for the faint of heart.
My attorney has dealt with this Trustee for years, he thought by doing what we did initially would satisfy her....obviously not. He even asked me in the beginning if I would think of putting off the wedding. At that time, and what he proposed and he thought would fly...was fine.
I am having horrid thoughts.....Its like this Trustee owns my life and I am totally at her mercy.....I know others who have been through this and their Trustee never dug and tried to scour for every penny....if they paid their plan payments, all was good. Most of these folks weren't even in a 100% plan and made more $$$ than we did combined.
SO....amend the plan is what I am thinking, but she will see my tactic, I am sure....but she can't force him to marry me, can't tell me where to live......I just feel like a deflated balloon.
Yes, I am learning fast this is a slow and arduous process.....
My parents even asked me if I should just say to heck with it....let the house foreclose (I surrendered anyway) and the rest of my debt is all unsecured..even the ex's credit card I have to pay as property settlement. If I paid him, and let the rest go.....fine, but can unsecured creditors garnish wages and stuff? Not to mention harass the heck out of you? I was hoping to just do the right thing...but this is making me a stress mess.

[justbroke]

Apparently your case looks "juicy" to the Trustee and it's ripe with enough money to have paid 100% (based on the claims so far). You have to think of the Trustee as the unsecured creditor's attorney. They represent the unsecured creditors and their interests as the "Trustee" of the bankruptcy. The (Chapter 13) Trustee can "sometimes" be an advocate for the debtor, but usually only to the extent that the Trustee makes no money if... well... you're not in a Chapter 13 and paying into the plan. (There are limits on how much the Trustee can "earn", but the Chapter 13 Trustee offices usually have 1,000 or more cases each, and they have a significant staff. I know that one of the many Chapter 13 Trustees here in the Middle District of Florida has 4 staff attorneys! That one Trustee also has 7 other employees that handle various things from accounting to running the office.) I'm not saying that they have a big machine to feed, but they do need to maximize the benefit to the unsecured creditors while ensuring that the plans comply with the law.

I would think, and I'm going to say that I do think, that your attorney knows this Trustee and knows this is standard ramblings. I have dealt with a Trustee that seems to have a standard boilerplate of an unfavorable motion for confirmation on standard things like the "liquidation test" (best interest of creditors test) and that the plan doesn't dedicate future tax refunds to the plan. Interestingly, the judge usually tells the Trustee that the tax refund thing is meaningless because the standard (district) plan confirmation order always includes that language. It's almost that they complain, just to complain. Otherwise, people won't think they're doing their job and that they're only rubber stamping debtor attorney plans. (The latter being just pure speculation on my part.) Another funny thing is that in my case, they complained about the liquidation test, and I quickly let them know that my IRS tax debt "obviously" exceeded my non-exempt property value, so what were they complaining about? (Yes, I suppose... boilerplate and just to complain.)

So if any of that makes you relax, maybe just a bit enough to get some sleep and to await your attorney meeting, then my job is done. I'm not writing these things just to make you relax, and nothing is fabricated. It's just how it works. Some debtors breeze through because they have absolutely no money. But then debtors like me that appear to have disposable income with a comma in it... tends to bring out the shark in the Trustee.

(No, I didn't mean to call the Trustee sharks...)

[BNKRPTinNC]

FWIW, the trustee is doing a job. Some are more empathetic than others but if your attorney is up to snuff then it all boils down to what the judge decides. It happened in my case where the trustee was filing a motion about some credit card debt that was in dispute. My attorney forgot to inform us that we didn't have to show, nonetheless we were there and even though had no legal rep present judge decided to throw it out anyway and approved our plan. A good attorney will know how to deal with a trustee and whether or not a court will approve a particular plan. If you are confident in your legal counsel and if he/she is not concerned then neither would I. A "difficult" trustee can muddy up the water but the judge has the final say.

Best of luck.

[amreynolds]

Thanks so much for the responses. I am learning a personal lesson in fortitude and patience, but it is so hard as I am a worry wart anyway.

Will be anxious to see what the plan is after meeting with attorney on Monday.