Creditor showed up

[startover10]

This almost too funny...

341 meeting, one creditor attorney showed up (we knew from their filing they were planning to attend). Somebody messed up, not sure if it was my attorney or me, but I did not come with my SS card, and in spite of two reams of organized papers, could not immediately lay my hands on a pay stub. We got rescheduled. On the way out, my attorney asked her what she wanted to know, she refused to answer.

Two weeks later, we try again. We racked our brains, why is that creditor showing up, but could only come up with billable hours. She showed up again, refused to talk to my attorney, wait until he's under oath. I wasn't worked up, had extensive records, nothing was being hidden, I'm quite simply, bankrupt, victim of the economy. SOOOO, she starts asking some silly meaningless questions. Really focusing on my IRA, which I've had for decades, and the only thing added in the last five years was my direct rollover 401k. Why didn't you tell us about your IRA when you took out the car loan, how long have you had the IRA, blah blah blah. I happen to have some training as an expert witness, so I'm only answering her DIRECT questions, and she was getting flustered. Side note, afterwards, I asked my attorney why he didn't object to her nonsense questions, and he replied, "because you had her under control and it was entertaining". Thanks bud. Eventually the trustee(?) orders me to answer the question, and when I replied, I have not been asked a question I can answer, he finally asks the question she couldn't develop. This is where it gets really really interesting. she started asking about my personal loan and my intentions of the personal loan. What personal loan? Are you going to affirm your personal loan? What personal loan? What are you going to do about your personal loan? What personal loan? Finally the trustee steps in and asks her if she has anything production to discuss, and we move on. He himself missed several questions that were asked of everybody else in the room except me, because we're going on 15 minutes at this point.

Two days later, this is still bugging me, why was she so focused on this personal loan that I have no idea what it's about. So I pulled my credit report, and damn, there it is, I have a personal loan with a 5k balance on it. Apparently what they did, was open a personal loan on my behalf, transfer the credit card balance to the loan and my guess, attempted to shield the balance from bankruptcy. Had she not shown up, they may have gotten away with it. Now, the state has filed an official inquiry, my attorney has subpoenaed their records, and we filed an amendment adding in this personal loan.

I joked with my attorney the other day, wouldn't it be ironical if there are punitive damages available for what appears to be an illegal act.

[jdcat]

Wow, that's unbelievable. I hope the creditor gets in trouble for that stunt.

[StartingOver08]

Is this by any chance a credit union?

[Flamingo]

There is more to this than meets the eye - pull out and review the credit agreement you took out with this creditor and see what you allowed them to do when you signed the agreement. It is quite possible you agreed to something and you never read the fine print. Plus you didn't give information as to what kind of account this is, any past background as to this creditor (from your posting it appears it is a vehicle loan), etc.

[startover10]

It is a credit union

The initial credit was in a credit card, and yes it is possible it was in the fine print, hence the state investigation, and my attorney subpoenaing the records. State regulatory agency stated this is a new one on them, they have not heard this one before.

[startover10]

This credit union and their attorney's have been an interesting challenge in other areas too.

I know this isn't the right sub fora, but it kinda fits in to the creditor meeting...

They tried to repo my car for non payment, but it and/or I were never around. In fact it was well hidden, and short of following me, and it was unlikely I wouldn't have known I was being followed. Anyway, in May 2009, I finally drop the car off at the CU. In July, they file lawsuit for return of the car in circuit court. In August I respond per se. Sometime after that, don't recall the date, they file suit for the entire loan amount. On December 15th, they file for summary judgment for the entire loan amount, but conveniently forgot to mail the notice to me until December 28th, for a January 6 court date. I get the proceedings delayed until the 21st. Judge cuts me a whole lot of slack and really perks up when I suggested the court sanction the attorney for lying on his filings. Judge agreed that they did not deserve the entire loan amount, and while he didn't sanction the attorney, came down pretty hard on him. The amended their filing to the amount they were due {although never proved that was the correct amount}. At the point of the trial, I had already started working with an attorney for filing bankruptcy, and I really really wanted it filed before the trial date, but we ran into a slight glitch, so they got the judgment

Dealings with the credit union has been the most difficult thing through this entire process. I can't imagine how someone that isn't 100% on top of things deals with them.

[Fresh]

This is incredible to read! You are really awesome

~Fresh~

[ryan]

Startover, thanks for all the details on this. Very interesting. I'd love to know the outcome of your atty's request for docs etc. Its good that you knew how to handle the other atty's questioning - many would not be able to do that as well...Good Luck.

[startover10]

They have not responded to the subpoena yet, and the state has not followed back up with me beyond confirming the initial inquiry. So, like everything else in the legal world, it's time to wait

wrt questioning by the creditor, I really do hold my own under questioning. Participated in several lawsuits as a technical expert witness, and usually see an attorney's ultimate goal several questions away. Think my fav was an 8 hour deposition. After about 7.5 hours I got bored, asked the plaintiffs attorney a seemingly innocent question, which instantly killed his client's lawsuit. Last 1/2 hour was spent with a 15 minute break while they reviewed my correct allegation, and asks some wrap up questions.

The best example of how to answer an attorney's question is to think about somebody asking you "do you know what time it is?" How many of you would look at your watch, a clock, or your phone and say it's 4:00? Everybody? That is absolutely the wrong answer. It does not answer the question, and it provides more information then was being requested. There is only one absolutely correct answer, and that is "NO". Unless you are directly looking at a clock you have no idea what time it is. you might be able to guess and get pretty close, but even then, that does not answer the question of do you know what time it is. When answering questions from an attorney, and especially while under oath, obviously tell the truth, because a good attorney if he suspects something other then the truth, while walk you back into the truth. Always only answer the direct question that is being asked, never ever offer additional information. If additional information needs to be added for clarification, that's your attorney's job to interject the info. In my particular example, the attorney wasn't asking the right questions and I refused to answer a poorly formed or unanswerable question. The trustee finally asked her question for her, and I truthfully answered it, but we wasted 5 minutes dancing before that.