Excuse me, but I think that I am in the wrong place here...

[Never_Again]

As much as I have enjoyed some of the company here, researching for this time of my life, and trying to help others, I think that it is maybe I am in the wrong place...

It is not that I don't enjoy helping others, because I do. However, there is a saying that I have heard some others say, and I guess that I never really understood it until recently:

"I may have been broke before, but I have NEVER been poor!"

Broke is a condition. It is a lack of money. It means that you can't pay your bills, you have no money, or something like that.

Poor, on the other hand, is a state of mind. It says that everything is against you, that there is no way to improve your situation, there is no way for "the little guy" to get ahead, "the man" just keeps me down, the rich get richer and the poor get poorer,... you know what I am saying.

I see many posts on here from people who are nervous, scared, and do not know what to do. That was probably all of us at one time here! They come here for help, and hopefully they get it. I know that I was one of those.

But, when I went into this, and filed for my bankruptcy in August, I knew that it was a temporary situation. I needed this chance to get my feet under me, and I knew that I, through my own resourcefulness, would come charging back, stronger than ever.

And I feel that I am on a good pathway for this to happen! And, as a surprise to some of you, I work in THE AUTOMOTIVE INDUSTRY! Not all of us in this industry are on the verge of starvation! Some of us (even in the domestic auto industry) are doing fine, and it is because of our own resourcefulness.

I see post after post about how to discharge my debts, and then how to "rebuild my credit." Hey, if that is what you want to do, more power to you, but rebuilding credit is not rocket science... Pay the bills on time from here on out!

Then, I see posts about how terrible everything is. Granted, there are some challenges, I agree, but if you constantly are dwelling on the fact that your situation is bad, and you can not get out of it because someone "won't let you," for whatever reason, then you become a self fulfilling prophecy! You won't succeed.

And then, it is the obsession with the FICO score. I hate to tell you this, but if you have to reduce your financial condition to a three digit number between 350 and 850, you have it all wrong! You would be much better served to monitor your net worth, income statement (money in and out each month, and the difference), and your budget (or spending plan.) No, it is not as sexy as FICO scores, and the mass of new plastic that you have been able to get after a discharge, but it is much better to look at net worth, income statements, and budgets. "But how will I rent a car?" Debit cards work fine in most instances, with some changes in how it is done. "But how will I buy a house?" With a 25% down payment, income that is in line with the payment you are making, and having it documented, and you will be just fine!

How many posts do we see on here about budgets? Very few! That is the only pathway to straightening out the mess that got most of us into this! Knowing what is coming in, what is going out, and trying to control the going out while increasing the coming in. I would love to see more people here asking about how to make a budget, tracking your income, saving money, trimming un-necessary expenses... you know, the boring stuff!

So, maybe I am in the wrong place. For me, bankruptcy was a temporary time. That time for me, is over now. I know that there are many others on here who feel the same way, and stick around to help others. I have respect for you, and I want to do the same thing. But, I definitely am not bankrupt any more! I would encourage everyone here to make bankruptcy a temporary condition, like being broke versus being poor.

I do apologize if this offends anyone, as that is not my intent. I hope that someone will be encouraged to move on, and perhaps ask how others are moving on, and learn from their experiences.

As for me, I think that I will hang out in the "Lifestyle Adjustments" area of this forum, and see if I can help move the discussion in some healthier directions.

[Flamingo]

Very few people that file bankruptcy have budgeted or know how to handle money. Before someone attacks as to that statement everyone needs to look back at the years prior to leading up to their bankruptcy and they will actually see how out of control things were. Excuses were made like, "well, hey, I can always refinance and pay it off," or "I expect one heck of a raise and/or bonus this year and can pay off all these bills we racked up." Bankruptcy, especially a Chapter 13, usually puts one back into reality as to what is going on in their financial lives and I believe anyone who files bankruptcy should be put through a Chapter 13 to learn how to budget and handle money. Chapter 13 is an excellent teacher.

I stick around on here to help out as to what I have been through myself but the more I see as to some postings coming in here with people trying to hide things and get away with things, I don't think my help is actually needed as people are going to do what they want to do. I had planned on slowing down on being on here due to my job due to having to travel more but travel for all employees (as most places) has been cut off except for something absolutely necessary. Also, when we were starting to go through the process of filing and the period before of trying to cope, this site did not exist and the ones that did were controlled by trolls who hated anyone who filed bankruptcy and talked to you like you were the scum of the earth. And also gave out bad and wrong advice. I guess after being burned as I was from bad advice given on one forum from people who stated they were financial experts but were actually trolls hoping you would listen and mess up, that is probably why I stick around in here to ensure people get correct advice We are getting beyond BK and have learned how to make major changesin our lives to survive so it will not occur again and I still run into problems as to BK still being on our records (comes off in April 2009) so I stay on here to also continue to learn as to credit issues and surviving after BK.

Great post - more are needed like yours.

[Bandit]

Everyone gets through this in different ways and not everyone lived above their means to get into this mess. By the time most people get back on their feet, they have already learned along the way and made the adjustments they need to make and you never see them again anyway.

I will admit this forum is not a very positive or joyous place and if I were looking for fun & celebrations, I would certainly not join a BK forum. With all the negativitiy involved if I had read that at the intial agreement , I would have been very reluctant to join thinking I need an adjustment when there was no adjustment in my lifestyle (speaking of finances) that needed to change.

The forum title is a bit deceptive as some of us learned that things happen out of our control that make it impossible to prevent BK or a future BK. What makes this forum unique in an opportunity is, there are a handful of people who stick around long after the smoke has cleared and way after the fire trucks leave to embrace others and to be constructive at the same time. A handful of people who learned that there are many areas of life in which people can help others. A handful of people who volunteer their time in helping those who are burdened because there is no way in hell the moderators alone could keep up with the flow of traffic.

and then of course there are some like myself who just like to chit chat about everything under the sun that never amounts to a hill of burnt beans
But! I get so much insight in many other areas of life. That is life way before BK and life way after BK because we all shared a common hurting and miserable time, and in some strange way, that understanding bonds most people who stay here.

After all the tears and suffering, after being at one of the lowest places in your life you will ever be, after sharing the grief with others who know what it is to be shipwrecked & beaten, when the people return for a moment of gratitude they always have something good & positive to say about this place.

It reminds me of the parable of 10 people who were healed and only one returned to say thank you. Here, the percentage who feel gratitude is far greater than 10%

[Bandit]

Very few people that file bankruptcy have budgeted or know how to handle money. Before someone attacks as to that statement everyone needs to look back at the years prior to leading up to their bankruptcy and they will actually see how out of control things were.

I think that is true for about half of the filers but there is another half that knows how to manage money very well and circumstances changed that put them into a position within seconds that would make them fall. There is a poll around here but I cannot recall the title.

[LeighRyan]

Excuse me, but I think that I am in the wrong place here

I too have suffered through bankrupcty and have emerged in a far better place. I am writing a book about my experience to try and help and encourgae others who find themselves in same situation. If you would like to share your thoughts on how bankruptcy has benefited your life, I would love to include them in my book.

[BROKENN]

After all the tears and suffering, after being at one of the lowest places in your life you will ever be, after sharing the grief with others who know what it is to be shipwrecked & beaten, when the people return for a moment of gratitude they always have something good & positive to say about this place.

This too is how I feel. I made it through "the process" because of this forum and quite successfully than if I hadn't studied and asked a bizzilion questions.

And now, I am still going through it post, as Flamingo said, as it is a lifestyle change that will be evolving and I do want to share those too.

I think the combined life experiences are impressive; and from financing, budgeting, credit, business, marriage, children, etc.. we have a lot to pass on.

The small percentage that want to abuse this get shut down pretty quickly and I do not fret as I see many intelligent people see right through it immediately.

[Bandit]

This too is how I feel. I made it through "the process" because of this forum and quite successfully than if I hadn't studied and asked a bizzilion questions.

And now, I am still going through it post, as Flamingo said, as it is a lifestyle change that will be evolving and I do want to share those too.

I think the combined life experiences are impressive; and from financing, budgeting, credit, business, marriage, children, etc.. we have a lot to pass on.

The small percentage that want to abuse this get shut down pretty quickly and I do not fret as I see many intelligent people see right through it immediately.

Me too.

I think I learned more by studying case law, attorney websites & going through the brief readings in the FAQ than having actual conversations as amateur as I am.

While at the same time I have learned that all forums are of the same personalities, this one will wear you down with a lot of negativity when you post often due to the nature of the circumstances.

But what you get when it is over is more than what you get at other forums. For the most part anyway.

You have been awesome, BROKENN.

[BROKENN]

No No No *****wagging finger*******

Don't you be saying good-bye At the least we can run our own threads!

You need some of your EGGNOG!! This is hard and changing is difficult and to re-live with others is too. You have helped over 2000 people. I say *** clink***

[Flamingo]

I think that is true for about half of the filers but there is another half that knows how to manage money very well and circumstances changed that put them into a position within seconds that would make them fall. There is a poll around here but I cannot recall the title.

Debt causes bankruptcy; in most cases, if the debt was not present when the job loss or other event occurred, one would probably not even consider having to file bankruptcy. The only exception to this is a medical emergency where there is not enough insurance coverage, no insurance coverage or savings to pay enormous bills. In fact, according to past articles I have read (i.e., Newsweek, Time) and other postings on here in the BK news forum, major medical situations with resulting enormous bills beyond one's ability to pay encompass over 50% of filings.

[Bandit]

Debt causes bankruptcy; in most cases, if the debt was not present when the job loss or other event occurred, one would probably not even consider having to file bankruptcy. The only exception to this is a medical emergency where there is not enough insurance coverage, no insurance coverage or savings to pay enormous bills. In fact, according to past articles I have read (i.e., Newsweek, Time) and other postings on here in the BK news forum, major medical situations with resulting enormous bills beyond one's ability to pay encompass over 50% of filings.

There are two others, Divorce and bad business adventure. I think a lot of people just assume that everyone who files BK is stupid and has no concept of how to manage money. BUt I will bet medical bills is on the rise because of all the layoffs & they wont have insurance now.

[Bandit]

No No No *****wagging finger*******

Don't you be saying good-bye At the least we can run our own threads!

You need some of your EGGNOG!! This is hard and changing is difficult and to re-live with others is too. You have helped over 2000 people. I say *** clink***

You are so right. I need to stay in the happy threads...but this place does not make me happy any more.

Vroom Vroom Vrrroooooooooom & drive our rocking American f-bodies off into the sunset.

I found this really cool christmas game & I thought of you because I know how much you enjoy puzzles. I cant remember now where it was.

[Flamingo]

There are two others, Divorce and bad business adventure. I think a lot of people just assume that everyone who files BK is stupid and has no concept of how to manage money. BUt I will bet medical bills is on the rise because of all the layoffs & they wont have insurance now.

You are correct - I left out "business" matters out of my posting and stuck to "personal" when I replied because it's obvious how a good business can fail and the debts mount, especially in this economy. Same with divorce but that is not as rampant as with medical situations or folks just going overboard with credit. As to your last sentence about the layoffs and no insurance, the trickle down effect from that with folks not being able to afford COBRA or be given any benefits after layoff otherwise is going to hit us all hard in the pockets more and more when these folks have to go to ER's and get seen without paying due to not being able to afford the care or start utilizing the credit cards they will not be able to pay if they cannot get back on their feet after the layoff with another decent paying job. It is bad out there and we are ALL going to be covering the fallout after it is all over. CNN reported the other night that every household in America will be paying $60,000 more each over the years to come just to cover the FIRST bailout already districuted to the banks. That is just the tip of the iceburg of what is yet to come.

Just as in any other matter or situation, there are folks who file BK who have no idea how to handle credit/finances that make it harder for folks who have to file BK for good, valid reasons, so the stigma is applied to everyone no matter what your situation. This ecomony is bringing out all the folks burdened with credit card debt/mortgages/loans who finally realized what they've done and are now "stuck" with having to file and/or lose their home. There are going to be a lot of hard lessons learned over the next few years and during that time I don't think the "stigma" of having to file will change much as most folks who did not burden themselves with debt or bad mortgages will still view people filing BK as allowing themselves to get in that position due to their own lack of financial knowledge and bad financial handlings.

[Confused33]

I have been here for a VERY short time but I feel like you that have posted in this thread have "embraced" me in a way.

Your input, advice, thoughts, stories, and anything else that you've added to the forums have brought me full circle on things. I was embarassed when I chose to join this forum but you all have made me realize that this can be a positive thing if you do it for the right reasons.

I have hope now and I feel that one day I WILL be wealthy where as before I entered this I felt eternally doomed. I had literally given up on the idea.

Thank you for what you've done.

[Never_Again]

Confused...

You are very welcome! I hope that more are helped by reading what we are saying here!

[AngelinaCatHub]

In my opinion, “Never Again” has spoken words far above the wisdom of my experiences. He/she has it right on. However our forum is a place of learning and in his belief, I think he has pegged one flaw here. We should have a ‘sticky’ for budgeting. I would hope that this poster starts one and aid those who, as I have seen, become repeaters. Only my opinion. ‘Hub

Merry Christmas