Originally posted by Help!
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Thank you for the replies. UST still intends to file a motion to dismiss. For anyone questioning whether a one-time payment to you such as a bonus, relocation check, gift from a relative, etc. can be included as income on the means test.... oh yes, it most definitely can. I specifically asked our attorney why this amount wasn't included as income on the means test before we filed and he told me "It was a one time payment. It does not count as income." Nice, huh?
Where to go from here... we don't have enough income to support a Ch. 13 payment. We will not re-file Ch. 7 because we're still above median and would have to rebut presumption of abuse. So, we are back to square 1, trying to make minimum payments only now we're short the $2200 we paid our lawyer *and* we have no savings since we used the money we took out of a 401K to go buy two cars (more great advice from lawyer). And, finally, we have Ch. 7 on our credit reports for the next 10 years without having received any benefit of "bankruptcy protection". We'll do the best we can and pray we don't get sued.
To anyone who is considering filing Ch. 7 with an above median income, here are a few pointers:
1) WORK that means test to your advantage. Don't feel bad about it. The UST's job is to work the means test to your detriment - don't give them the ammo. Get your 6 month income as low as you possibly can while surviving. If you have medical bills, pay them in full instead of paying your unsecured creditors. Decrease your exemptions on your W4 and pay more in taxes. Contribute to a 401K. Make charitable contributions (up to 15% of your income). Time your filing so that the six months ending on the last day of the month before you file does not include overtime, bonuses, eBay proceeds, tax refunds, economic stimulus check, garage sales, etc.
2) Make your bank account histories look saint-like. Do not deposit anything other than your paycheck. Restrict checks/debits to groceries, gas, rent, utilities... only the necessities. For anything else, take out cash to keep on hand or use a Visa gift card which is not tied to your social security #.
3) Get the best attorney possible. If you can, sit in on some 341 hearings. Stand in the hallway and watch the attorneys. Some will be early, well-prepared, communicating with their clients about what to expect at the hearing and their case. Others will walk into the courtroom late, disheveled and casually drop some paperwork in front of their clients that they "forgot" the UST asked for two weeks before the hearing. *ahem*
4) Look for the attorneys representing the "no snag" Ch. 7's, the ones that are over and done with in 5 minutes. Avoid the attorneys whose clients are being interrogated for 15+ minutes about the mistakes the lawyer made in their petition. *ahem*
5) If you see some good attorneys in action, ask them for their business card or note their names. Once you have a few to look at, take a look at their open cases in PACER. If their below median Ch. 7's are taking 5 months, that's a sign they don't have their act together. If their above median Ch. 7's are all being dismissed for abuse or converted to Ch. 13, that is also a bad sign.
6) If you don't have 100% faith in the attorney you've chosen, you have doubts about them or they answer your questions with wishy-washy BS answers (like, "I don't see why the trustee would have a problem with private school tuition")... stop right where you are and get a better attorney!
I am actually okay with the outcome (it was what I expected), glad that we gave it our best shot and to tell you the truth... happy to have fought our last battle with the UST. One last thing... don't think for a second that the UST gives a damn about your circumstances. It's all about the numbers.
Where to go from here... we don't have enough income to support a Ch. 13 payment. We will not re-file Ch. 7 because we're still above median and would have to rebut presumption of abuse. So, we are back to square 1, trying to make minimum payments only now we're short the $2200 we paid our lawyer *and* we have no savings since we used the money we took out of a 401K to go buy two cars (more great advice from lawyer). And, finally, we have Ch. 7 on our credit reports for the next 10 years without having received any benefit of "bankruptcy protection". We'll do the best we can and pray we don't get sued.
To anyone who is considering filing Ch. 7 with an above median income, here are a few pointers:
1) WORK that means test to your advantage. Don't feel bad about it. The UST's job is to work the means test to your detriment - don't give them the ammo. Get your 6 month income as low as you possibly can while surviving. If you have medical bills, pay them in full instead of paying your unsecured creditors. Decrease your exemptions on your W4 and pay more in taxes. Contribute to a 401K. Make charitable contributions (up to 15% of your income). Time your filing so that the six months ending on the last day of the month before you file does not include overtime, bonuses, eBay proceeds, tax refunds, economic stimulus check, garage sales, etc.
2) Make your bank account histories look saint-like. Do not deposit anything other than your paycheck. Restrict checks/debits to groceries, gas, rent, utilities... only the necessities. For anything else, take out cash to keep on hand or use a Visa gift card which is not tied to your social security #.
3) Get the best attorney possible. If you can, sit in on some 341 hearings. Stand in the hallway and watch the attorneys. Some will be early, well-prepared, communicating with their clients about what to expect at the hearing and their case. Others will walk into the courtroom late, disheveled and casually drop some paperwork in front of their clients that they "forgot" the UST asked for two weeks before the hearing. *ahem*
4) Look for the attorneys representing the "no snag" Ch. 7's, the ones that are over and done with in 5 minutes. Avoid the attorneys whose clients are being interrogated for 15+ minutes about the mistakes the lawyer made in their petition. *ahem*
5) If you see some good attorneys in action, ask them for their business card or note their names. Once you have a few to look at, take a look at their open cases in PACER. If their below median Ch. 7's are taking 5 months, that's a sign they don't have their act together. If their above median Ch. 7's are all being dismissed for abuse or converted to Ch. 13, that is also a bad sign.
6) If you don't have 100% faith in the attorney you've chosen, you have doubts about them or they answer your questions with wishy-washy BS answers (like, "I don't see why the trustee would have a problem with private school tuition")... stop right where you are and get a better attorney!
I am actually okay with the outcome (it was what I expected), glad that we gave it our best shot and to tell you the truth... happy to have fought our last battle with the UST. One last thing... don't think for a second that the UST gives a damn about your circumstances. It's all about the numbers.